Many bikers have been victims of motorcycling profiling. AMA summarizes the issue by saying that “motorcyclists are frequently stopped by police as they travel simply because they ride a motorcycle or are wearing motorcycle riding apparel. Often these pretext stops are accompanied with the explanation that a traffic infraction has occurred, which is not always the case.
In some cases people have been told they are violating a law that does not exist. In other cases the violation cited simply has not occurred. Motorcyclists come from all walks of life and most are law abiding citizens. They have their travel interrupted on their way to work, family events, meetings, church and other places.”
Minnesota GOP Rep. Steve Drazkowski has introduced legislation “establishing policies to address motorcycle profiling. “The legislature finds that the reality or public perception of motorcycle profiling alienates people from police, hinders community policing efforts, and causes law enforcement to lose credibility and trust among the people law enforcement is sworn to protect and serve,” the bill says.
“No stop initiated by a peace officer should be made without a legitimate reason; the fact that someone rides a motorcycle or wears motorcycle paraphernalia is not a legitimate reason. The idea is for state officials to “make a deliberate effort to have a discussion within their agencies and be certain that they are conscientious and in their work not allowing profiling to materialize and become part of their decision making. Law enforcement policies and training programs must emphasize the need to respect the balance between the rights of all persons to be free from unreasonable governmental intrusions and law enforcement’s need to enforce the law,” Drazkowski says. (source Fox Twin Cities)
Cops may not stop you but they will never stop profiling. Profiling is a normal human endeavor. You walk into a store and the clerk automatically profiles you. You see a chick walking dwn the street and you automatically profile her. We all make quick assessments all the time. “You can only make one first impression” is profiling.
So, the legislation is just a make nice effort.
Hey ! You wanna talk about profiling ? Try driving/riding across the Kansas , Utah , Wyoming or Nebraska state lines with Colorado plates regardless of what vehicle you’re on/in . And god help you should you make it as far as Idaho , Montana , Oregon or the Dakotas . Cause if you do you’re about 40% guaranteed to be pulled over and made to go to the nearest town/city for a complete search including sniffer dogs . Yet another ‘ Unintended Consequence / Collateral Damage ‘ of the recent actions here in CO
Now that ………… Is illegitimate profiling !
try going anywhere with California plates on…….the worst of it is the cops setting up outside motorcycle shows writing tickets wholesale for some legit stuff and a ton of not legit.
I got a ticket at Biketoberfest in Daytona. The officer said that my headlight was not bright enough. It was 1 pm on a bright and sunny afternoon. He did not make any measurements or stand in front of the bike to see the brightness of the light. I requested a court date.. I went to court and the judge said that If I sent him a letter from a motorcycle shop stating the headlight was good he would dismiss the charges and that I could just mail it in and not come back to court. I got that letter and sent it certified mail (so I know they got it). I then received a letter stating that a guilty verdict was withheld an I owe them $116.00. Someone in the Volusia County Florida court system Lied to me and did not hold to their word. Its a mater of principal now and not the money. I want to fight this thing but don’t know how to go about it.
In Daytona This type of ticket is handed out like water, figuring that people are from out of town and will just pay the fine. They also wonder why attendance is down at major events.
Anyone remember the BETT (biker enforcement tactic team) of the late ’70’s in So Cal? Ultimate in profiling, complete with roadside routine ass kickings at rush hour going to or from work on your scooter. Once stopped 3 times within 1 mile by 3 different team members resulting in 3 seperate citations for the identical equipment “violations”, and of course the same complimetary physical treatment. Not whining, just reminiscing.
i break laws that don’t exist everyday, sometimes i get caught, but i’ve gotten away with so much that i don’t make a stink, don’t sweat the petty things pet the sweaty things.
I was at a party with non-bikers, they started in on how good “Blacks” (that isn’t the word they used),- had it and what were they bitching about. I always tell people like this if they want to know what it is like to be a Black dude- profiled and harassed by the cops-Buy a Harley, get the loudest pipes you can find , get all the biker garb and tattoos that go along with it the life style. Might even put some one piece patch on the back of your new BLJ then Just ride around for a while, especially on bike night or rallies, THEY will find you. Then you will know!
We have them set up outside rally sites and breathalyse every motorcyclist that leaves.
Don’t see it at Rugby match’s or car shows………………….
…. then do what I and the wife do . Vote with your checkbook . In other words . If the locals don’t want you there and their police are intent on harassing you …. don’t go and spend your money elsewhere . Hit back where it hurts . Right in the old back pocket
BTW – ” Breaking laws that don’t exist ” The oxymoron of the week … 😉
its too bad some communities have elected to shun the very cash flow their regions have decided to endorse..bike rallies..even if some people don’t go based on previous outings & bad experiences, the truth is there will always be enough new people to go and take their place and then be singled out..
The growth of bureaucratic despotism is undermining American liberty.
Hey J.H. try BEING Black, having ANY TYPE of cycle
with all of the paraphernalia that goes with it…
Yes, you have just become a walking target for “The Man”
Non-Bikers ????
Sounds like they were doing their own type of “profiling”
Really sounds like you need some NEW friends to hang out with !
Problem is TJ we have very few rallies and the locals do not get a say, our policing is under central Govt. Every time there is some terror attack around the world Governments in western so called democracies make laws and rules that undermine the average Joe and Joanne’s rights, then tell us it is for our own good…………………………………… look at what’s happening in Aussie.
Gee, guess I don’t know what it’s like to be a —- (the word they used) and be profiled, harassed, and stereotyped for being a Biker – American . Sorry you get profiled, harassed and stereotyped more for being an African – American riding a motorcycle. You should consider find a new means of transportation if it is that bad.
The key to stopping all this is to pass legislation against motorcycle profiling, like we’ve done in Washington state: http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=43.101.419
A friend moved his machine shop to AZ and I drove the big truck. It was hot out there so I went to get on the plane heading home in shorts and a tank top. Big mistake for a hefty guy with lots of facial hair and tattoos.
I was subjected to the regular search. Then I was strip searched. Then they swabbed my hands, ran the swabs through some machine, and came back and said “Your hands tested positive for chemicals.” I said “Yeah, I just moved an entire machine shop. There are lots of solvents, lubricants and coolants involved there.”
They finally let me pass but I almost missed the flight. My female companion (also heavily tattooed) was also hassled but not to the extent I was. We were most definitely profiled and it gave me a whole new understanding of why some folks are tired of being profiled and hassled.
Mike Greenwald nailed it! Instead of all of your belly-aching, go out and actually make a difference with your local government. Get biker rights hard-coded into the law. In Texas, We have Legislative Day where 2,000 fellow riders descend on the state capital and meet with law makers.
This has been going on for as long as I can remember and though I hear people complain all the time I have to wonder how many actually complain to the right people.
If Everyone that has had an issue and or does not think this is right will contact their legislators and tell them they want it stopped it will make a serious difference. If emails and phone lines are jammed they will get the message.
What I ask my legislators to do is to Decrease Spending to the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration stating that if they have enough money in their budget to support the funding of other agencies to Harass Motorcyclist then they have too much money. In most cases I also mention how poor their safety record is. Stop The Money To Fund Roadside Stops and You Will Stop Them.
There are also numerous groups that are fighting for vehicle operators rights just like we have for Motorcycle Rights and I share information with them as well as use information they supply to their members.
Contact your local newspapers and TV stations and see if you can get them to do an article on what is going on. You will find many other people who are unhappy with law enforcement and their actions concerning operators of all kinds of vehicles.
STOP THE MONEY and YOU WILL STOP THE HARASSMENT
Ken Glen
You are 100% correct on Daytona and other major motorcycle events.
The cops make a lot of money for the city and or county and they specifically like out of state people because it is Cost Prohibitive for indivuals to return to court to fight the charges against them.
Some years ago I received a ticket for exhaust while in Daytona. I live 100 miles south of there and when I got hope rode my motorcycle to the Police Station and had it checked. The officer who checked it told me he was well aware of what was going on in Daytona, checked my motorcycle which did have a muffler with baffles in it and signed off that it was okay. Yes I still had to pay court costs which I think is wrong.
And people wonder why Police and the Court System are disliked. In my opinion they Stole Money From Me and many others. Why would anyone like someone who did that?
@J.H. F off for telling someone they should find another mode of transport instead of fighting this issue
Gents All: we stand out by virtue of how we travel (different vehicle), how we dress (unconventional), and our tendency to gather. Those things make us targets for those that resent zebras in a crowd of horses. Some of those resenters wear badges and judicial robes. The SQUIDs don’t help our case much either.
August 29, 2015 will be the 50th anniversary of the day I got my first motorcycle. Since the summer of 1968 I have held a license to ride on the street and for most of those 46 years I’ve had a street bike or two around. With the except of speeding tickets, I have only been stopped twice by police in a questionable manner. One was for noise on a Trident cafe racer in about ’74 and once on an Gilroy Indian in ’02 from a cop that wanted to know where to buy one, his dad or uncle or something had one. My bikes may have equipment violations such as turn signal, reflector and tail light modifications, or aftermarket exhaust systems but I have never gotten a ticket or even been questioned about my bike.
I ride primarily European bikes, I wear all the gear, all the time including a full coverage helmet. I don’t own a black leather vest. I don’t try to dress like the cast of a 1968 biker movie.
LEOs are NOT profiling motorcyclists, they are targeting gangs and those that choose to emulate gang-favored apparel.
Reyn Mansson,
You said, “LEOs are NOT profiling motorcyclists, they are targeting gangs and those that choose to emulate gang-favored apparel.” Evidence of these stops, ongoing, seems to refute what you are saying.
Federal funding still flows to States and areas for the purpose of motorcycle only stops. If gangs were being targeted, law enforcement motorcycle clubs that “emulate gang-favored apparel” would be under suspicion and the discerning eye.
Interesting reading….I’ve been to 29 states so far on the bike (traveling from Minnesota) and have never been stopped once, In fact I’ve had the opposite happen; when lost I usually seek out a cop to ask for directions – and have always received nothing but help…and (yes) I do ride a Harley. I realize the stories above are true and I know there are good and bad cops, but overall – I’d say good. Just sayin…
Deacon, I’m glad you have been fortunate enough to avoid the LEOs. Checkout I-94 thru Minnesota before during and after Sturgis. Police operations stopping no one but motorcyclists for speeding. Ticketed me for 4 mph over the limit and it wasn’t the cop giving me a break. That’s how fast I was going. That was in 2007, in 2008 they were out again but I managed to avoid the same problem. I’m sure some smartass will try to say they were just trying to save lives…right, you are more in danger from a speeding car or truck than by being 10 mph over the limit yourself.
Mike G. Checkpoints and profiling are two separate issues. To be sure checkpoints are violations of many rights and freedoms we are promised as Americans. And there are certainly unwarranted stops of riders because they match a general description of those who have been proven to have a propensity to be members of criminal organizations.
My point is that police do not profiles the vehicle, it is NOT because you are on a motorcycle that you are being stopped. Motorcyclists aren’t targeted, just a subset who likes to pretend it’s 1969 again.
Reyn M.
Profiling by some Law Enforcement Agencies has lead to the belief within those agencies that 50% of those operating motorcycles do not have the motorcycle endorsement or the license to operate. That assumption has lead to the “checkpoint” system of shakedown. It is called vehicle profiling and is commonly done with rental trucks, automobiles, and motorcycles.
With predictive profiling, criminal profiling gets more controversial. Instead of seeking a particular suspect based on evidence at a specific crime, predictive profiling attempts to guess which people are likely to commit a crime that hasn’t happened yet.
This isn’t a revolutionary idea by itself. Police officers don’t just react to crimes: They patrol, observe and try to spot suspicious behavior that could mean a crime is going to take place. Few people would question an officers’ right to investigate a suspicious situation or question a suspicious person. Even when police departments use their criminal profiles as a justification for searches and arrests without warrants, those practices have been upheld by the Supreme Court.
Hey Doug, Thank You !!!!!!
Hey J,H, I just said your a BIG target that’s all .
I sincerely believe that some times you make yourself a target
Does not matter what it is, that attracts the attention:
Loud pipes
Splashy paint
Loud stereo
Pulling wheelies / stoppies on the interstate
Making dumbass comments, when you shouldn’t
Whatever !!!!!!!
I choose what defines & what goes on in my life
Riding just happens to be one of the choices I made.
And for almost 30+ years it’s been a good one.
I’ve met WAYY Too many good people who don’t give rat’s rear end about skin color
(a lot of them from this very blog) to give up an activity/lifestyle/hobby that I’ve come to love.
Nuff Said !!!!
Let’s see. I identify myself as a motorcyclist. I wear dead cow, I have ink embedded into my skin, I have more hair on my face and less hair on my skull than most peeps and I don’t suffer fools well.
I’m out and about on my motorcycle. A cop stops me. OMG. Gee, never saw that coming.
Another sordid tale from the Duh files.
Put another way, you buy the machine, the clothes, the accoutrements. You watch the tv shows and you go to the places that your mother warned you to stay away from. You fancy yourself a little bit of a risk taker.
The law does too. Quelle surprise.
Am I losing my mind or are people here actually supporting the practice of pulling over and harassing people based on their mode of transport and/or sense of fashion?
Apparently the 4th Amendment to the constitution isn’t nearly as sacrosanct as the 2nd in this country and that is disturbing.
Right on Chris! Liberties can only be eroded when we don’t stand firm against those trying to work around them.
1. Don’t consent to searches of person or bike without knowing what specifically is being searched for and what is the reason they think it is there (probable cause). Riding a motorcycle down the highway in and of itself does not constitute probable cause.
2. Don’t answer questions. They are simply fishing for incriminating responses that will give them probable cause. And, they are allowed to lie, you are not. (e.g., “I’d like to have those pipes on my bike. They sound awesome! What kind are they?” Thanks officer! The’re Bassani Road Rage Megaphones.
3. Do ask whether you are being detained or you are free to go.
4. Do plan that if you exercise these rights, your road-side stop will take much longer than others and you will piss off the cops.
In my experience, many bikers have big egos, think they know the law inside and out and have no problem pushing a cops buttons because their “rights” are being violated. When I get pulled over on my bike/car generally I just treat the cop with respect and in every case (outside of some speeding tickets) ive never been sighted. I run short shot straight pipes without baffles. I have amber driving lights and run 18″ inch ape hangers. all of which are illegal in most states (apes are legal in PA where I live ) When I go through a small town, I stay off the gas and show respect by not trying to blow out ear drums.
Many people have been profiled for being bikers but many of those people have earned tickets with their attitudes.
Hmmmmmm…… ???
RE:
“… just a subset who likes to pretend it’s 1969 again. …”
Ya, there could be something to that.
So how many of these complaints are real and how many of-em are just so much “puffery”….
Sure, if you use your pipes and/or attitude to get attention, chances are you’ll get it.
But if you trying to pretend or recreate the “good ol-days”….. Well….
-A- They weren’t all that good.
-B- Your mostly too late.
-nicker-
Hey Blackmax and Doug –What don’t you understand about the meaning of the word con·sid·er
kənˈsidər/Submit
verb
think carefully about (something), typically before making a decision.
At least when we have a problem with being profiled and heavy handed by the police- We don’t go to the Runs or the places that we were hassled, they don’t get our money. We join ABATE and other motorcycle rights organizations. We don’t block the interstate with road blocks. We don’t loot and riot and burn the city down..
Yes, we do join ABATE or KBA/KMA
Or at the very least ,support their efforts on behalf of ALL of us
To Consider is to think about something, a choice to make…
Got nothing to think about …
Already made my choice(s) a long time ago
I’m good with the upside & the downside
How about you ??
Consider that for a moment …..
Blackmax….
RE:
“… I’m good with the upside & the downside …”
Spot on Dude….!
It was once a given, if you step outside the “general public norm” you could expect some amount of push-back. And as riders we accepted that reality as the “cost of being individuals” on the outskirts of “the herd.”
It wasn’t any big deal and we didn’t go sniveling about how badly we were mistreated. Truth be told, there was some amount of gratification in knowing that your very existence was pushing the buttons of those who took themselves a tad too seriously.
What we’re seeing now though is an over reaction by the increasing number of people who, today have decided they want in on the “experience.” But are clueless as to what that experience even is, let alone understand what we who obviously “live and love it” get out of it.
See, what they don’t understand is…. “if ya have to ask, you’ll never know.”
However, our real “down side” is that in the Legal and social turmoil they create with their yammering for new laws, their boorish behavior, and their “TV Reality Shows”….. they’re doing a great job of upsetting the equilibrium it took the rest of us so long to work-out….. 🙁
-nicker-
Thank You, nicker !!!
Appreciate the support
Keep the rubber side down. Bro !!!
Also, you expressed the message a lot clearer than I could
Thanks again !!!!