The McLennan County District Attorney’s Office has filed civil motions naming 25 individuals arrested in the May 17 Twin Peaks motorcycle gang shootings seeking forfeiture of hundred of thousands of dollars’ worth of motorcycles and vehicles impounded after the shootout that left nine bikers dead and 18 others injured. Texas state law requires that forfeiture motions be filed within 30 days of an arrest and yesterday Wednesday June 17 marked the 30th day since the shootings that claimed nine lives and left 18 injured. The actual process of forfeiture can only take place after a person is convicted of the crime alleged in the forfeiture. Forfeiture, however, is a civil process and not part of a criminal action.
In most cases forfeitures are filed in connection with drug cases. Items sought for forfeiture can include vehicles, cash, real estate, firearms and other items. District Attorney Abel Reyna said Wednesday that Texas law requires that prosecutors prove that items sought through forfeiture were used in the commission of a felony crime or were purchased with money generated from a felony crime. She said that the filings do not indicate any guilt on a defendant’s part. Once items are forfeited, the state may sell them and use the proceeds or may convert the items for use by police or other law enforcement departments.
This Waco fiasco is out of control. I’m usually pro police, but this is some BS that isn’t supposed to happen in the USA. Most non motorcycle types could care less as they think the bikers are guilty, but the cops are the guilty ones here. I doubt any bikers even fired a gun, although there were undercover cops that infiltrated the Cossacks and probably started the whole mess. Why were cops with silenced rifles waiting in the parking lot? I’ve heard that one biker shot a pistol and ran inside. Nothing about the fight starting in the bathroom is true. Read the Aging Rebel blog for more up to date info on this. As Americans we should all be worried about our government and law enforcement running amok and taking away our rights.
Steal Your Face – Read the facts .. not the conspiracy theorist versions of the facts . This was a turf war plain and simple . The bikers firing first at each other .. and then at the police . End of story ! All the fault being on the two rival gangs [ for the record the Cossacks are a subsidiary club of the HA’s who are at war with the Bandidos ] who have been at each other in Texas for the last three years culminating in this as you called it …. fiasco . Both sides now learning what it means when people say ; Don’t mess with Texas . And for once I’m applauding Texas … because they are taking a stand against the 1% garbage trying to take over our lives and neighborhoods
TJ – I assume you are referring to the “facts” that come from the Law Enforcement agencies involved that are willing to speak on the matter? If the truth ever does come out, I think will find the “conspiracy theorist” versions that are coming directly from the people that we there are a lot closer to the real truth.
Here is an article that points out many of the inconsistencies between the “official” narrative and the truth:
http://news.yahoo.com/waco-police-rarely-dispatched-to-twin-peaks-prior-to-biker-shootout-records-reveal-015135212.html
An excerpt:
A month after the shootout, no murder charges have been filed, and the Waco city attorney’s office has asked the Texas attorney general for permission to bar basic police reports about those who died. Forty of the arrested bikers remain behind bars, some of them in lieu of $1 million bond — the identical amount initially assigned to everyone. Research by the AP found that 117 of those arrested had never been convicted of a crime in Texas.
All else aside, these forfeiture laws are contrary to the basic premises of American justice. While the premise of taking illegally obtained gains is fine on the surface, the actual practice is a joke that often results in simple theft by government.
Two Joints,
You are so far off the facts that your doing nothing but imitating a wind tunnel.
Why no coroners report ?
Why are the basic police reports being withheld ?
Why were the police there with silenced rifles before the meeting ?
Like I said before if these folk were African Americans there would be riots, but in many peoples eyes if you ride a MotorCycle even in the 21st century you are still a second class citizen.
Waco PD have a bloody terrible reputation. It sounds if this whole fiasco was a set up and the trap was set by the Cossacks who were never invited in the first place.
TJ, now I know why you’re called two joints. You are an idiot. Did you ever stop to think that the cops stepped in it so bad that they are lying/trying to cover their butts. You are a disgrace to all motorcycle enthusiasts and need to shut your blowhole. I said I liked reading your point of view in prior posts, I take that back. YOU SUCK! Keep following the story because you will be proven wrong. BAAAAD Sheep.
All of these forfeitures are bad in a lot of ways. They default on their loans, the interest rates goes up, insurance on bikes goes up. When the bikes are finally sold at auction, when they are practically worthless, the balance of any loans minus the pennies on the dollar sale price is still owed plus towing, storage fees on and on. The forfeiter will carry the balance of the debit with them and any legal wages they try to make in the future (assuming they are out of jail) will be taken from them for the “forfeitures” with 25% interest.
Not into the 1%ers and what they do to the Motorcycle businesses or motorcycle community, for a lot of reasons, this is just a few of them.
Steal Your Face, when I read your comment a few days ago saying that you like reading TJ aka TT comments I thought you didn’t know who you were dealing with, now you know what most of us know. TJ aka TT is just what you said a idiot. He lives in his own fantasy world and impresses no one but his self. He’s also know as a Figjam and Bell End.
It is very telling that a month after the alleged “shootings not one person is charged with shooting anyone. Hmm, 1 million bond and no specific charges. very fishy , never seen anything like it. The lawsuits will be endless but maybe a class action. Gerry Spence where are you!
Note the comment made by District Attorney Abel Reyna .
She said that the filings do not indicate any guilt on a defendant’s part. Once items are forfeited, the state may sell them and use the proceeds or may convert the items for use by police or other law enforcement departments.
We do know that the forfeiter procedure is very misused and often used by the system to finance their operations.
Pay real attention to the statement about converting items for use by police or other agencies.
Through the years members of law enforcement have been caught using motorcycles and other items in very questionable circumstances.
In some case members of law enforcement have ended up purchasing motorcycles at pennies on the dollar.
The law on forfeiter should exclude any agency or anyone involved in the procedure from profiting from it. That would be a start in the right direction. If in fact items are forfeited proceeds should go to sources distant from law such as education, health, welfare etc. Keep the temptation of greed out of the procedure.
In every conspiracy theory there’s grains that started it ..we’ve lost control people it’s going to be each for themselves .. It’s only a matter of time
What Woody’s said X2. Later Jay
This whole incident has distressed me greatly. What we are seeing is a total nullification of the United States constitution. The $1 million bail violates the 8th amendment. The incarceration of the bikers violtaes the 5th, 6th & 14th amendments. And, constitutionally, there is no such thing as forfeiture of personal property as this violates the 5th & 14th amendments. What we are seeing is a foreboding of the direction this country is going. Bikers – to me – are the canaries in the coal mines (used to detect poisonous gases in the past). It is easy to dismiss these violations against a segment of society (Bikers) held in disdain by most but it is very telling. When will the people wake up and see that the direction this country is now on can ONLY lead to a totalitarian government?
It will really be a problem to those not charged as they will have to file within a very short period to get their property back due to the way these forfeiture laws work.
RE:
“… the filings do not indicate any guilt on a defendant’s part…”
Yes, forfeiture, through any process, before guilt is proven would sure as hell be theft.
But then so is what the IRS does in many cases.
The problem is that our system of “justice and governance” has been tweaked for so long, by so many different interstate groups (on all side of the law) that in so many cases it no-longer functions as designed.
But then Life isn’t ease or fair Know your limitations and act accordingly. The Real bikers have know this for years and have learned not to “soil there own nests.”
Point is if you want to do something about it then get politically active. Joint the AMA. Go to your town council meetings. Support those who are putting in the time and effort to effect the policies that affect you.
If that’s too much trouble for ya…. then suck it up and take what the man hands out.
Being a real biker isn’t simply about dressing up, waving and calling everyone “Bro.”
-nicker-
Every biker in Texas knows basically what happened. Having the COC meeting in Waco was the first mistake, just riding I-35 through there with loud pipes will likely get you pulled over. We know who rules the streets here, and they take showing no respect very seriously, and we saw the consequences. To play in their world you know the rules and had better follow them. I’m not saying it’s right or wrong but that is the way it is. Same with the situation in CA. and what happened in Laughlin, AZ Look what’s happened in Australia and Canada. It could happen here.
B.A.J. hit it on the head !!!
COC meeting in Waco, with combative elements
that everyone knew (even the cops) were at odds
Very combustible mix just waiting to happen.
Now did the cops add to this, yes !!!
Are they probably lying about what happened & a cover-up is going on
Definitely, Yes !!!
Are people being detained illegally & excessive bond being applied
Hell Yes !!!
All of this will get sorted out & the lawyers are going to have a field day !!
But dig underneath & look at the start, somebody started something in a
public place that, if they would’ve thought about it , had to come out to a bad ending..
Everybody knows you don’t take care of “business” in a public place !!!!
Somebody forgot that simple rule & the price has already been paid, with more to come
Nothing like legal proceedings to bring out the legal experts……
I still seriously doubt that any one reading any of this knows the facts well enough to state what went on accurately. You have the ones backing the cops thinking they acted in the public’s best interest and did absolutely nothing wrong, and you have the conspiracy side of things thinking it was all a set up. Truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
Asset forfeitures will have to meet certain criteria when the cases come before a judge. If the bike owner still owed on the bike, McClennan county would have to pay the lien holder what is owed on the bike. So it isn’t as if this is strictly a money grab by the county, but certainly there are some elements of a money grab. Point is this would be pretty standard in any case where possibly felonies occurred.
it going to all come out in court. The DA still has to PROVE their case and the defendants still get a chance to face their accusers. Until then, the accused are going to have to wait and play by the rules as does the DA.
One final note, Babe Laufenberg has often said, “just because your paranoid doesn’t mean someone isn’t out to get you”.
It will all come out in court……..
Good point Darryl but with a million dollar bond each AND forfeiture of their motorcycles, that doesn’t leave a lot left for legal representation. If I said that is what the governments want, would that be a conspiracy theory?
The canary in the coalmine image is true. Bikers (and the other motorcyclists who hate to be referred to as bikers) as a group are not viewed in a flattering light. Another unfortunate truth is that the same faulty clan mentality that drives that disdain of us by others drives it in us towards others.
I’m proud to be a biker. That said I have spent my long life among some seriously bigoted uncompromising rednecks who will be the first to rant about taking it to the third worlders and the rest of the paranoid dogma we get wrapped up in. These are my brothers and I love ’em but the dif between most of my people and most lawmen is not so much as we want to make it. They are the largest affiliated clubs. When you are the biggest you make the rules and history is what you say it is.
Are the cops right? Well, hell no. Should we be amazed that they are circling their wagons and using every scheme they can come up with to cover their butts? Hell, no.