On My Way To The New Indian Motorcycle Factory







This Thursday April 10, I am flying to Charlotte then will be picked up at the airport and travel 30 minutes away to Kings Mountain, the home of the new Indian Motorcycle Company. There, I will meet with Chairman Stephen Julius and all his team, listen to their business plans, product information, visit their facility and discover their new model(s). It’s always exciting to see a motorcycle company preparing the launch of a new product from engineering, to parts purchasing, to marketing, to customer service to dealer development to manufacturing. And for all the reasons you know, even more when this company is called Indian Motorcycle.
You, my readers are the largest Blog community of passionate and influential bikers that all motorcycle marketers want to reach. So, I would like that in “comments” you state all the questions you would like me to ask directly to Chairman Stephen Julius when I will be with him all day on Friday. And I am certain that him and all his team will highly value your questions, comments and concerns. Please, do it now before I meet with all the Indian Motorcycle people in charge of the new model(s) launch.


65 Responses to “On My Way To The New Indian Motorcycle Factory”

  1. 1 Danny Apr 6th, 2008 at 11:26 pm

    Wow. I want to know everyting. Was about to decide on a new bike. (I have 2 already). Maybe the next one will be an Indian. I am mostly interested by the engine they are going to use.

  2. 2 Al Apr 6th, 2008 at 11:27 pm

    Is it the new model shown on the picture?

  3. 3 Paul Myers Apr 6th, 2008 at 11:29 pm

    Photos. Tech sheet. Date of launch. Warranty. Price?

  4. 4 Rich Loyd Apr 6th, 2008 at 11:33 pm

    Cyril. Do you work for them as a consultant?

  5. 5 mike x Apr 7th, 2008 at 1:14 am

    That is pretty exciting news. Will major components be rebuildable ? ie: Flywheels ( no go on 07, 08 H-D big twin, new “knife edge” at wrist pin end , bad ! doesnt last ) brake calipers (no go on 08 H-D brembo) to name a few (there are more). What will be the guidelines for dealer development? We have seen the “car people” come in and pretty much ruin 1/2 of the Florida H-D dealer systems (no feel for the motorcycle people result :empty stores ,new faces every couple of months ) . Will they use testing in an “uncontrolled” enviorment to get real world breakage result ? (let test riders sign off and pound em on our old roads) because a bad result out of the box would not be good for business. Is their advertising person smart enough to know not to waste endless amounts of money advertising in magazines (most of them blow) keen, savy , EXPERIENCED RIDERS get FREE info on the net . This blog is so far reaching, really what else would you need. You gotta laugh at ALL the money Harley spends on advertising (like we dont know about them?). Production forecast ? how many models? I saved the most important question for last. Are these people involved true motorcycle fans ? or are they business guys looking to make money? that is the key to longevity in this very tricky enviorment.

  6. 6 Hondo Cat Apr 7th, 2008 at 8:41 am

    I’d like to know what Indian expects to bring to the market in this increasingly depressed economic climate? Unless they have something besides the Indian name, something innovative or unique and affordable, I say deja vu…………….another failure, e.g., American Iron Horse.

  7. 7 Hondo Cat Apr 7th, 2008 at 8:54 am

    On second thought, I’ll be a little more optimistic, I guess. I think Indian could do something pretty cool with sculptured hard bags to capitalize on their fenders. Baggers are the thing now. More of a utilitarian thing with increasing gas prices and more people like me commuting to work and stopping off at the grocery on my bike.

  8. 8 Rodent Apr 7th, 2008 at 8:58 am

    Oh, hum.

  9. 9 Paul Gaffney Apr 7th, 2008 at 9:15 am

    I just wish that the New Indian company does it right. We need good news.

  10. 10 Big Joe Apr 7th, 2008 at 10:20 am

    I had visited their website a few times last year. Didn’t they give people the option to reserve their 2008 indian? Maybe it was for 2009. Did anyone out there reserve one last year (07)? If so, what kind of support and feedback have you been getting from Indian though this process? Just curious.


  11. 11 Soulfur Apr 7th, 2008 at 10:54 am

    Ask them to buy Excelsior Henderson and put x-wedges in softail frames to pump up their bottom line

  12. 12 Soulfur Apr 7th, 2008 at 10:56 am

    Ask them to open a custom shop in Springfield so they can have a place to link them with their history. Small shop putting out custom Indians like the Fender or Gibson Custom Shop

  13. 13 Soulfur Apr 7th, 2008 at 10:56 am

    Ask them to start spending some time on the jockey journal

  14. 14 J Apr 7th, 2008 at 11:06 am

    Actually, I would like to hear their views on why they think they will succeed, where others have not; It’s not being negative, it’s just business, and at this point, their enterprise doesn’t look comparable to even Excelsior-Henderson….. How stable are their credit facilities? Are they looking at a public offering? What makes them viable in a soft market?

  15. 15 Pop Apr 7th, 2008 at 1:03 pm

    Three of my fellow Iron Indians have been to the factory. Oh yeah… Pop rides a ’03 Chief Vintage, the bike that killed Gilroy or so they say. Test machines are visible on You Tube vids released by the factory but intentionally blurry to hide details. The guys that went to the factory were slammed by the new rides but signed confidentiality requests and I can’t budge them on much that I didn’t already know.

    If you liked the looks of the ’02 and ’03 Chief models then you will like the looks of the new machines.

    Anyway, Brembo- yes.
    Mill, ground up redesign of the PowerPlus 100 bottlecap motor used in the Gilroy. The re-engineering has delayed the release for waay too long. It has the familiar (to Gilroy riders) round barrels and sculpted rocker boxes but a lot of the exterior cues are redesigned and it’s EFI and it’s a 105. this is not a descendant of the 88″ S&S. It is the descendant of the PowerPlus 100.
    Base model Chief is a limited preorder for ’09 model to be released this year. If you want one, pony up a grand (info on the factory website) and they will call you to discuss what they offer stock and what you can trick out. You decide against, they scratch your name, refund your cash and call the next guy.

    As far as car guys selling them, it’ll have to be car guys with big pockets. Dealerships are going to be in the millions, location requirements, stand alone and a laundry list of other hoops to jump through. I’ll be surprised to see them stick to that bill of goods, but we’ll see. For now, one dealership, factory owned, brandy new with a artsy fartsy skirted fender entryway. I think they said about twenty miles from the factory.

    The Iron Indian flagship event is Branson, MO the third week of May. I expect to see a complete or very close to complete production Chief at that rally. for those of you closer to that than NC, it might be a good place to catch a glimpse of the new machine.

    One more thing, if price is a big consideration for you, you probably want to look at something else. I don’t know that to be true but considering the outlay of start up cash and the limited number of machines in the first year model run, they ain’t giving them away.

  16. 16 Pop Apr 7th, 2008 at 1:11 pm

    Soft market notes.

    The company is wholly owned and privately held. The parent is Stellican in whose house is CrisCraft, distressed luxury boat mark, Riva, a European yacht company, again on the skids but re energized by Stellican, cash register company, some Italian soda pop company and so forth.

    They target distressed “iconic” brands and reorganize them, build the mark on it’s legend and sell it as top of the line, reliable and heirloom quality.

    Hey, it worked for them so far. No public offering, no externally manipulative BOD. They put their money down, painfully slowly develop the strategy and then execute without excuses to shareholders.

    My issue with them isn’t the strategy. My issue is that the mark IS a legend and although I have no investment in their enterprise, I do have an emotionaql investment in the product. They had best get this right.

  17. 17 homer Apr 7th, 2008 at 3:29 pm

    Ditto to what Pop has said–sums it up and no need to re-iterate. Maybe Cyril will have a few more tidbits when he returns.
    The electronics and ignition (other Gilroy era warts) have also been redesigned and apparently improved on.
    The plan is a methodic and deliberate slow start, and ramping up as demand and factory/dealer capabilities require. Relaxed dealer requirements are likely a part of the future plans. The Iconic American Brands apperal line has been launced and should coordinate open for business with the factory owned dealership.
    Plans call for and pre-design has already started on future bikes/products–with a PP105 Scout likely next up. You may eventually see other “formats’ of bikes–speed bikes, off -road, etc brandishing the Indian name.
    I have met and spent a little time with the two Steves and I do have confidence in their history, achievements and vision for the brand that I too have an emotional investment in. I also have 2 Gilroy era chiefs and would love for the brand to thrive.
    Those of you with Gilroy era bikes (and eventually Springfield) can feel free to visit my site for info, supplier list, manuals, etc to aid with keeping your scoots on the road..

  18. 18 2CHFSinAR Apr 7th, 2008 at 3:52 pm

    Homer and Pop did a pretty good job on the quiz. I wonder how many units are planned for this year and how many next.. How much for the basic model would be nice to know.

  19. 19 Steve Apr 7th, 2008 at 5:18 pm

    What I have heard is that the first run will be limited to the number of people who put down deposits. And in order of time deposit was placed.

    They will use these bikes to s l o w l y ramp up production to make sure quality of the bikes off the line is in front of quantity.

    Sounds to good to be true but if they really do it that way it should be great for the quality … but what about the bottom line?

  20. 20 homer Apr 7th, 2008 at 6:29 pm

    last I heard the initial production goal was under 800 units, and had to do with the # of initial dealers and demand…also, they wanted a manageable number of bikes so they could get real world feedback on for quality control….that was from a year ago, so the plan may have evolved. As for bottom line, they are spending their own money, and have stated their plan is long term–they are looking 10, 20, etc yrs down the road, so bottom line at this point is not as important. That’s why the dealership requirements are so stringent–they want to make sure the dealers are in it for the long term also. Another reason is that they with the consumer to have a “unique Indian experience”.

    As for price…can’t elaborate what I don’t know–maybe KM doesn’t know yet?? but it will be what it will be…I would imagine a minimum $25k for a chief–the flagship platform, a “Premium” build…other pricepoints and models to follow. Gilroys were priced at 22- 26ish (and they were losing $1k/bike), but they were going down $1k for ’04.

  21. 21 Marilyn Stemp Apr 8th, 2008 at 9:57 am

    I had the opportunity to visit the factory and meet with the staff yesterday in Kings Mountain. They plan to produce 750 bikes in the first year, essentially one model, the Chief, accessorized to four versions, base price in the low 30’s. Looking for a 2009 model year to be released in Fall ’08 but that’s contingent on getting the assembly line running this summer, and that depends on current engine durability testing. They are hopeful but also determined to release bikes only when they’re ready. They’ve read the blogs, know the history, they’re probably reading this!

    The staff is small but very tech heavy, mostly engineers, many with impressive track records in the motorcycle industry. The owners are spending their own money and have one equity investor, no plans to go public. They seem to be spending as necessary, not foolishly, taking a slow growth approach.

    They’ll assemble engines and whole bikes at the factory using components sourced mostly in the US, some from Europe, a bit from China for expediency, the latter to be phased out I’m told.

    Same style frame as the Gilroy Indian but retooled, built using robotic fixturing. The 105 ci Powerplus EFI engine (50 state compliant) has nicosil-plated aluminum cylinders, forged pistons (piston weight reduced to address vibration issues), new crank, more. They’ve re-designed and re-positioned air intake, re-designed electrical system. Trans is a Baker 6, 5.5 gal one-piece gas tank w/integral fuel pump, short and long fenders are offered. Lower CG, seat height may be a bit lower than Gilroy bike, handlebars have been altered in both width and reach dry weight about 740. Concerning looks, the bikes I saw incorporated refinements in styling that result in improvements over the Gilroy bike, a cohesive machine, no parts tacked on as an afterthought.

    They’ve been intentionally circumspect, partly to build interest – we’ve all been wondering what’s going on and talking about them, right? – and partly to keep quiet until they get it right. I’ll look for Cyril’s take later this week.
    More detail provided in my article in IronWorks. Sorry, mike x.

  22. 22 stirstick Apr 8th, 2008 at 10:27 am

    Still sounds like they are building another evo softail with enormous fenders. They want to bring back an Indian Chief , which were quite nimble and well balanced, based on a poor handling,already beat to death frame design. they should have started with a honda.

  23. 23 burnout Apr 8th, 2008 at 10:28 am

    I have a saying ‘There is no love in business’. So many times I have to make decisions that I just don’t FEEL like making. If the current owner(s) is committed, REALLY committed to making the Indian successful, I believe it’s gonna take a LOT of love AND money…………………………… but mostly more money! peace

  24. 24 Dave Apr 8th, 2008 at 2:34 pm

    It has been wait and see from the start of this incarnation in 2004. Looks like the “5 Year Plan” is about to come to fruition. So far slow go seems to be good medicine. Pop stated it all so no rehash here – I wish them well. Their apparent success in other motorsports makes for intriguing thoughts as to how they will do. Good luck Indian.

  25. 25 Steve Apr 8th, 2008 at 2:47 pm


    I could be wrong but I thought the softail design has the suspension running under the bike, on the bottom of the frame? Utilizing two small shocks.

    Never knew that a mono design mounted to the top of the frame was refereed to as a softail design.

    You need to let a bunch of people know the proper definition of the softail.

    Thanks for the heads up.

  26. 26 mike x Apr 8th, 2008 at 4:06 pm

    Hey , the motor looks to be rubber mounted , thats a plus if it is. The thing i am wondering about (cuz i am kinda dumb) is how a 740 lb ( got this from marilyn) bike , with that wheel base is gonna handle with the steering stem clearly behind the forks ? Everybody , even me knows the magic to the H-D touring bikes is the way the steering stem is in front of the forks ,so in essence it is “being pulled” rather than “pushed” (that was all BUELL genius by the way , along with rubber mount) . Another thing i am wondering about is who would put up a million or more (questimate for a dealership) dollars for someone else’s idea ????? with no “tangible” items. Remember how tricky this enviorment is . I have read about their edumacations (thats how you spell it right?) and yes any mom and dad would be proud , But again MOTORCYCLES , ITS PURE EMOTION . It will be interesting to see how the guy in Gilroy (First dealership flagstore last time) or others still in existance gets treated by this “new” team , because he (they) is STILL there “representing” Indian . I would think it to be RUDE to ask him to pony up a million. This small group might have a clear picture of what they are after so maybe they will have to “wear ” more hats than they originally thought . Unless they got a lot of friends (that sounds bad) who can “see” that same picture. Marilyn , by the time you get your details to print , it will be “old hat”.

  27. 27 2CHFSinAR Apr 8th, 2008 at 4:28 pm

    I think you need to do some checking of your info about the Gilroy dealership. It wasn’t the first and is not still there, according to the info I have checked on. About the million, don’t think anyone is being asked for cash up front for a dealership. Might cost that to build what is specified. Big difference.

  28. 28 2CHFSinAR Apr 8th, 2008 at 4:30 pm

    Evidently StirStick has never riden a Gilroy Chief.

  29. 29 mike x Apr 8th, 2008 at 4:51 pm

    Hey 2CHFSinAR Go to google and punch in “Gilroy Indian” it is the FIRST listing . Was not Gilroy where the factory was ? (watch this monkey tell me it was in springfield , geez) I must have been smoking both crack and weed, and dreamed that i visited the web site and halucinated that i called and ASKED. Let me guess you are an “air traffic controller” with a Bush /Cheney bumper sticker on your car. Uh, I did check .

  30. 30 homer Apr 8th, 2008 at 5:07 pm

    i don’t think handling will be an issue..the frame design–maybe the one think Gilroy got right–is very stable. The 02/03 PP100 chiefs handle extremely well…the Vintage is the heaviest (800 wet) handles like a charm, as does my 02 (Joe Malfa Custom)–weight unknown, but it is >740 as that was the weight of the stock chief. Both of my bikes have the lowering kit installed and a racetec kit in the forks, and the handling got even better.

    Not sure if the PP105 is rubber mounted or if there will be an option to choose/not choose rubber mount–time will tell…

    One thing I find new in Marilyn’s note is the fender bit–that one is new to me…the rest seems to re-iterate known info and/or speculation. Some may be still evolving and may change by the launch..

    As for the dealerships, the initial tier (as much as first 50) will be Indian only, and the cost (per the release from Indian) could be as much as 3M…NOT a franchise fee, but fees for land, a building (to Indian specs) and inventory. They have stated that somewhere down the line smaller dealers will be invited, esp those who have been there for the Gilroy owners thru all the turmoil..

  31. 31 mike x Apr 8th, 2008 at 5:51 pm

    Hey Homer thanks for the info , amazing what proper suspension does ! I was looking on the “new sight ” and staring at that top motor mount , it was reminding me of the old 3 point system with that skinny top mount . It looks rubber mount to me the way the motor sits up , but i could be dead wrong. Wondering what the” Indian specs” for dealership will be like? All i know about is how the Harley shops have such incredible overhead that it gets passed along to “joe customer” in my world people dont see reason to pay 85.00 an hour for service . I think alot of the people my way “get the bike” from the dealership and do not return ,unless of there is WTY involved. 15 years ago they (H-D) went really agressive towards building these “palaces” holding alocation of units as “the hostage” . Now we gots everyone on the edge of 95 (paid super top dollar for the land) and with construction and so on its a big heavy number. Factor in the grandiose life style of most owners , maybe a couple of divorces, and all you can afford to hire is 9.00 an hour youngster with not too much experience. Go to any Hog meeting anywhere in Florida and you will hear “this talk” or go to the “super castle” go upstairs and look into that window . Not too much going on. It is like that in most of those places. Hopefully Indian can see whats going on , not sure just how far they want to get carried away on the merch side , i can see helmuts , riding apparell , and shirts , boots , are we gonna have dog leashes and dog hats and coffee? Its a tricky world , It started with the bike , so i think that is where all the focus should be for now . They seem smart , Im rootin for em !

  32. 32 2CHFSinAR Apr 8th, 2008 at 7:26 pm

    Mikex must have read that info on the internet so it must be true. Gimme a break. I have it on pretty good authority that the first dealer was Santa Rosa V-twin. What about the info that they are still there. I know a fella that was there lately. It’s locked up and empty. Called and asked what of whom, Don Nofrey. Now there is a supreme source of information.

  33. 33 mike x Apr 8th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

    Ok, chiefs thanks for the update. the guy i spoke with sounded angry as well , i figured he was having a bad economy , uh ,day. i am more off then more on . come on that was funny! and i take back calling you a monkey , i apologize !

  34. 34 Rodent Apr 8th, 2008 at 10:28 pm

    Remember Wayne Backman from Albuquerque..He was the first of the recreators of Indian with engineers from the super secret Sandia Labs…I know him and his scam quite well..I was asked by a person to deturmine whether this person should invest in a dealership offered by Mr Backman…..I said pass and retained my good health……then we had another pretender to the crown hyped by a Samoan actor claiming he was a native american and he was related to the Springfield Tribe….And now, Oh well.

  35. 35 Dave B. Apr 8th, 2008 at 10:35 pm

    I would like to know the different models they will be offering, options, warranty info, how many dealers are slated to carry Indian dealer name, I know its a lot to cover… but I would really like to see Indian back on the road, and their plan to stay there.
    Dave B.

  36. 36 homer Apr 8th, 2008 at 11:22 pm

    i’ll post some pics of the the progress at the factory on my site in the next day or two..
    10,000sf “iconic” is what has been mentioned for the dealerships…not sure what that means..

    dave, a PP105? scout is next on the block…i hope they use that fat tire design as an option like Gilroy was…their early plans called for about 50 Indian exclusive dealers in the next 3 yrs….well, not sure when that clock starts or started..

  37. 37 Power Stroke Apr 9th, 2008 at 8:26 am

    “Still sounds like they are building another evo softail with enormous fenders.”

    Hey stirstick, you obviously don’t know didly about modern Indian Chiefs.

    The ’02 through ’04 Gilroy Chiefs are not softails. They have a proprietary frame and suspension system that shares absolutely nothing with any H-D softail or it’s many clones.

    It’s handling simply embaresses softails, in fact it has a very sporting nature about it that belies it 700 plus pounds.

    I have friends that are crotch rocket jockeys, and they have all been amazed at how well it handles.

    Check your facts before making blanket statements.

  38. 38 Marilyn Stemp Apr 9th, 2008 at 9:27 am

    Dave B, they say just one model for now, a Chief in 4 versions: Standard, Deluxe (2-up seat, paint options), Roadmaster (outfitted for touring with bags and windshield – 2 sizes of shields) and Vintage (windshield, solo or pillion option, special tank badging, long fenders, vintage paint choices, fringe). The P&A line will offer grips and pegs, shift linkage, inspection & derby covers, hard bags, leather accessories like tank bibs and leather-covered levers.

    Homer, it’s a 150 tire on the Chief, I think. Can you confirm? No plans for anything over a 200 is what I heard – no room under the fender. Don’t know any specs on the planned Scout.
    What’s the address for your site? I’d like to see it.

    Did any of you current Gilroy bike owners complete a survey from the new Indian people about satisfaction, or lack thereof, with those bikes?

  39. 39 Genodeluxe Apr 9th, 2008 at 10:55 am

    another $30,000 or more overpriced barge.

    The country needs an affordable Sportster kind of bike
    with a bigger motor for about $11,000.
    They would sell a ton of them.
    But no they have to aim the rich garage keeper buyer
    who sadly is leaving choppers to go on to ????
    The Bourget and Texas Chopper buyer is fading fast.
    I think its great that we have another American made
    bike but it needs to look good and be affordable.
    The last Indians were butt ugly like the Excelsior Henderson
    and most Victorys.

    Think about it
    the coolest thing Harley makes now
    is the Nightster. Tell Indian to make a
    fast lil streetfighter thats reliable and affordable and there is a dealer nearby and they will have a hit.
    Big ugly fat fender bikes with hard to find parts and not dealers is just
    a bad idea from the start.

  40. 40 burnout Apr 9th, 2008 at 11:14 am

    I need a headlamp lens for an 01 Scout. Anyone? Kiwi doesn’t have one. peace

  41. 41 Steve Apr 9th, 2008 at 12:30 pm


    You know Wayne? Then you also know he was fishing for investors and not pouring millions of his CASH into his project.

  42. 42 2CHFSinAR Apr 9th, 2008 at 2:01 pm

    Geno, everbody’s entitled to their opinion, but I think you may be in the minority about lumping the Chief in with the Victorys and the E-H in the butt ugly category.

    You are the only person I have ever heard that doesn’t like the fenders and lines on the Chief.

    As for $11K bikes, China, Korea and Japan make buttloads of ’em. Just pick one out.

    I am not a bit surprised that choppers are dying, never was a thing practical about them, besides being the epitomy of butt ugly, course that’s just my opinion, but it is evidently not in the minority or they would still be in demand.

    Oh yeah, the Nighster looks alot like an Indian Scout, ‘cept it won’t run with it. The Scout, that’s your fast little streetfighter.

  43. 43 ANT Apr 9th, 2008 at 2:17 pm

    It’s Wayne Baughman, not “Backman ” a mistake I would’ve let go if it wasn’t attached to the claim that you knew him. He was preceded by Philip Zanghi. Never heard anything about engineers from Sandia although he did hire the Batten Corp to design the engine. Please know your history or at least double check it before spreading incorrect information.

    As to the KM affair…good luck. Bringing out a slightly(?) modified model of a bike that was penned some 8 plus years ago at a higher price in a down market and economy smells of disaster. Doesn’t matter how good it may be.

    Dealer requirements are wholly unrealistic. Anyone smart enough to have the wherewithal to meet the criteria are going to ask the hard questions (due diligence) regarding Indian’s financial stability etc etc.

    All this talk about the company being in it for the long haul (10-20 years always gets bandied about) is pure fluff. What would you expect them to say? “We’re gonna hit it hard and fast and suck all the money out of everyone while the getting’s good”??? Seriously, their claim of the “long haul” is hollow and meaningless. Think of it from this angle: They may be in it for the long haul, but how can they expect a dealer to survive if the product is overpriced and can’t be supplied in the quantities that a dealer wants/requires? And that’s not even addressing the upfront costs they demand of dealer applicants.

    I’ll believe it when I see it and not a nanosecond before. Their press releases have been too few and far between (and lacking ANYTHING of SUBSTANCE) for this writer to take heed.

  44. 44 Power Stroke Apr 9th, 2008 at 4:20 pm

    Speaking of “pure fluff” ANT, hows that Crazy Horse thing going?

    Boy if this ain’t the kettle calling the pot black I don’t know what is.

    “Bringing out a slightly(?) modified model of a bike that was penned some 8 plus years ago at a higher price”

    In fact your entire statement sans the first paragraph can just as well be applied to Crazy Horse Motorcycle.

    Damn, irony is humorous!

  45. 45 Steve Apr 9th, 2008 at 4:36 pm

    What is Crazy Horse Motorcycle?

    I searched but could only find a transport company, painter, a custom bike built to raise money for the memorial …

  46. 46 Steve Apr 9th, 2008 at 5:12 pm

    I just hope that they bring back the Spirit. The Chiefs are cool and all, but the Spirit is my dream bike. Not as much tin but still have it where it counts, in the ponies. I think to really compete with HD they would have to diversify there product line anyway. That means the Chief, Spirit, Scout, and maybe enven something else thrown in for good measure.
    Maybe something like the V-Rod, I don’t like them, but I sure see a lot of them driving around. They could call there’s the Tomahawk. LOL
    …wait that’s not a bad idea… in my humble opinion of course.

  47. 47 Steve Apr 9th, 2008 at 5:26 pm

    Oh, and please be sure to ask if they will have dual disk or not.

  48. 48 2CHFSinAR Apr 9th, 2008 at 6:24 pm

    Steve, I copied that link but evidently this site won’t let it link up. Type it in. It’s an outfit in Seattle that
    is building a custom bike using some gilroy parts and some maybe proprietary items and rebadging them as a Crazyhorse. Looks suspiciously like a Chief.


  49. 49 2CHFSinAR Apr 9th, 2008 at 6:31 pm

    I stand corrected. It did link up just clickit.

  50. 50 Steve Apr 9th, 2008 at 7:08 pm

    Crazy Horse Motorcycle?
    It IS a joke right?

    Most of the bikes they show pictures of and appear to be claiming as their builds were out when Gilroy was in business. I remember seeing them in magazines and on the American Thunder TV show.

    Never trust a builder who claims someone else’s work.

  51. 51 ANT Apr 9th, 2008 at 7:23 pm

    We’re building engines and have been concentrating on that. Sorry that the fact the we have something IN PRODUCTION AND AVAILABLE seems to have gone undetected by your radar.

    We’re not the ones boasting about $30 million budgets and a building full of engineers either. The facts are that what we’ve accomplished with a skeleton crew and budget is pretty remarkable by anyone’s standard, but perhaps yours.

    Have a loverly day.

  52. 52 homer Apr 9th, 2008 at 8:03 pm

    Marilyn…150 is about what i’ve heard, and it kinda makes sense…I put either a 130 or 140 on my bikes and whichever it was is the largest you could go on the Gilroys (w/o chain conversion), due to the frame and/or swingarm setup..a bigger tire was needed (mainly for aesthetics) and with the mods Indian has obviously made, i’m sure they’ve addressed this. Maybe you could go larger with a chain conversion–dunno…

    Please don’t break any non-disclosure agreements as I know you may not be able to elaborate much until your article. However, as I mentioned above, the 02/03 chiefs are superb handling, but looking at the pics it seems something is different. Did you notice or learn anything new about the frame’s geometry or wheel base?

    Ant, I think these bikes have been redisgned and not just "slightly modifed", Maybe much major noticeable redsigning was not needed, however, it appears that all of the known flaws of Gilroy are being addressed?? I think they actually started tabula rasa….and tried to keep the bike (esp engine) aesthetically familiar to the Gilroys, but the improvements make this a new machine. The goal was to make as many parts be exchangeable or retrofittable with the Gilroy PowerPlus bikes..I’m sure we’ll learn more about this as time goes on..

    Marilyn, my site is at http://www.indianmcinfo.com or you can just click my name, lol…
    haven’t updated it in a while, but will get to it this week…remember–i’m not a web designer, lol..
    There’s lots of info there to help the Gilroy owner, and I actually gave KM the nod to referr people there. I hope to update w/the Springfield owner stuff I have, and maybe KM info one day…
    A couple other useful links are http://www.indianmotorcyclecommunity.com and http://www.jamltd.com

  53. 53 homer Apr 9th, 2008 at 8:13 pm

    Marilyn, one other thing that you mentioned that I actually wasn’t aware of is the fenders…hmm…I sent someone in the know at KM some pics of “modified’ chiefs..bobbers, etc..you mentioned “short” fenders.. for the record..if it’s a bobber or anything similar..”I” take full credit..

    Ant.. remember, the dealer requirements are not a franchise fee..just an estimate to start from scratch, buy land, float employees salary and build and run the biz for a while.. Their estimate of production is based on the estimated # of dealers and estimated demand…maybe $30 is the estimated cost now–you never know, base chief may be more like $25 or so??? Don’t know about you, but I’ve spent well over 10k on each, and perhaps approaching $20k or more on one of my bikes to get what I wanted..if the factory has a ton of options, I think low numbers (sub 1000) will move annually no problem..And when the other price points and styles come out, dealers will hopefully be ok–esp when multi-line dealers are allowed in.

  54. 54 ANT Apr 9th, 2008 at 8:52 pm

    Hiya Homer, how’s it hangin? There’s an elegant solution to running a far wider tire but am not inclined to share it with certain privately owned entities. And then there’s the inherent chassis geometry issues, not so much as dangerous as something that should be optimized.

    That’s right, I’m an asshole (in case no one has noticed).

  55. 55 homer Apr 9th, 2008 at 9:51 pm

    Hey Ant…how’s it hangin? Well, I know there’s a “that’s what she said” joke in there somewhere!! LTNS..hope life in the great NW suits ya…

    You got a fat tire chief running? w/o chain conversion..come on, do tell….you can share–I’m on no payrolls, I won’t tell :)…I don’t know how wide is “wide enuff” tho.. maybe as wide as the rear on the ’07 fatboy??
    With all those engineers and a test rider that apparently tries to kill himself each time he gets on the bike, I’d imagine KM’s changes have maxed out that frame…but time shall tell…
    oh, and fwiw..you’re more of a smartass, than an asshole..lol

  56. 56 ANT Apr 9th, 2008 at 9:57 pm

    We had that 200 tired right side drive 6 speed fuel injected bike at LAST YEAR’s Branson…IIRC you rode it (or at least saw it)…has the JD caught up with your memory cells? LOL

    Listen, not for one moment to I pretend or claim to be a genius, but history is filled with many instances of some very smart people overlooking fixes or improvements. I’m sure there have been times when you peeked over someone’s shoulder and offered up a “why don’t you do it this way” sort of comment to which they smacked themselves on the forehead for not having seen it.

    It’s called a fresh perspective (which matches my mouth, which is ironic considering how foul it usually is)

  57. 57 ANT Apr 9th, 2008 at 11:16 pm

    Forgot to mention that the above bike is indeedy a belt drive, and is similar to Victory in that you needn’t pull the wheel or swingarm to change the belt. Doesn’t that just give you piss shivers?

  58. 58 Christopher Apr 9th, 2008 at 11:42 pm

    Please ask if they will be producing parts and accessories for the ’02-’04 Powerplus Chief’s?
    I also really want to know if I am going to get the rest of my 1-year unlimited mileage warranty, I lost out on 8 months when they closed up shop in September 2003.

    Enjoy, take lots of pictures.

  59. 59 homer Apr 9th, 2008 at 11:57 pm

    Ah yeah…I do remember that bike..very nice. Yes, I rode it, but only a mile or so. It ran pretty cool. I gotta admit, for whatever reason(s), fuel injection will have to grow on me–I feel the same as when I ride my friend’s fatboy (very seldom, lol) and I’m sure the first KM chief I ride I’ll have the same feeling…maybe it’s a “too smooth” kinda thing? it is pretty nice that there’s less warm up time and not as much “cold naturedness”…now if i can just figure out how to make the fairer sex the same–at least towards me!

    when I stated “maxed out that frame”, I was referring to the geometry and such, not tire size…

    I liked the RSD for the reasons mentioned. I think big dog started going rsd last year and I wonder if most major manufacturers will follow suit..
    I mentioned that bike yesterday on the IMC forum, but didn’t remember it was a 200..I think that was aesthetically nice and is a good size and is probably as large as I would go. That mite be a nice aftermarket kit…ya know.. I’ll have to find my pics and take another look..

    well, my website is not cooperating and i can’t update it…gotta figure out what’s going on there..

    oh,..and it was crown..I don’t drink jd!

  60. 60 Steve Apr 10th, 2008 at 11:37 am


    Remember, your 1-year unlimited mileage warranty started the day you purchased your bike while the Gilroy factory was open. If you bought the bike after they closed you should have been informed by the seller that there was no factory and no 1-year unlimited mileage warranty and the dealer should have offered you a thrid party warranty. Which, depending on how many years you bought, could still be effective today. I have seen them go for up to 5 years!

    Since Gilroy shut it’s doors back in September of 2003 … basic math comes into play on your 1-year unlimited mileage warranty.

  61. 61 ANT Apr 10th, 2008 at 1:58 pm

    Hey Homer, I refuse to drink Crown as it reminds me of royalty, which in turn makes me think of England, and THAT reminds me of the bad mojo of Brockhouse and the current owners of the Indian name. Gadzooks and Oddbodkins!!

    Yep, EFI is smoother than a polished baby’s bottom…as you pointed out, no hiccups during the warm up phase (and overall). The downside of course is the potential to leave you stranded and unfixable on the side of the road…carbonators and points can be repaired with a hammer and screwdriver. But you can’t stop progress, which in this case is spelled E.P.A.

    As for the 200 tire, that’s about the largest that makes sense from a style AND technical standpoint. Granted there are those who want the steam roller look and that’s great for them, but even they’d have to admit that tire widths of that scale begin to create handling issues. So we’re back to the 200 size (or perhaps just a touch wider). I personally can’t stand the original size tires on these Chiefs, what with pizza cutter sized rubber beneath that Fat Albert fender. Reminds me of the body width overhang of a ’59 Chevy (google that and you’ll instantly understand that statement).

  62. 62 Steve Apr 11th, 2008 at 6:08 pm

    Once you go bigger than 180 all handling goes out the window.
    How many AMA superbike or any none straightline racers do you see with a 180 or bigger?

    But you already said you don’t build bikes anyway. 200 tire hints that you don’t ride much either.

    If Indian went with a larger tire they would show they only care about fads and not real bikes for people who ride.

  63. 63 KC Cheef Apr 14th, 2008 at 9:03 pm

    Don’t they have one Investor?
    To the tune of $30 Million?
    I’ll do some looking around–I have the info somewhere.

    I would be interested to know why they promote their link to Springfield so heavily, and kind of run on by their link to Gilroy.
    Seems their pedigree is more closely tied to Gilroy than Springfield but we don’t get much mention on their website.

  64. 64 singing bare Sep 2nd, 2008 at 10:43 pm

    the market for Indian motorcycles is ready to act. I never could understand how going head-to-head with HD was justified. If the bike is that good, it will sell itself. Trying to out sell Harley is a big mistake.
    Everytime I park my 99 chief, people will walk right past a dozen good looking harleys to check out my bike and talk me up. Indian stories are everywhere and people get misty-eyed sharing them. I think that explains whay so many Gilroy Indians have so few miles. It wasn’t the ride of their life, it was the bike of their dreams. I put 36k miles on my 01 Chief and have 7k miles on my 99.
    Indian Motorcycle is less a product and more of a phenomena. I have attended lots of Springfield Indian type events and had various reactions to my Gilroy Chief, regardless, its the heart each owner has for the name Indian that keeps the legend alive.
    If Stellican can get a bike out that captures that heart, the price will be a small hurdle. Sustainabilty is the big test.

    Good luck.

    singing bare

  65. 65 Barney Sigman Jan 19th, 2009 at 11:26 pm

    I was able to buy a 2003 Harley Davidson Heiratge Springer Soft Tail with only 4000 miles on it, Then I was lucky enough to run into someone selling a ” 2002 Indian Spirit Deluxe ” with less then 5000 miles on it, They our both Great bikes and i love them both, i can’t wait to see what Other Great bikes Indian comes out with.

    P.S .. After all ”Indian was the first bike ever made.”……….they must know something.

    Indian Fan

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