Breaking News. First Pictures Of The 2010 Indian Motorcycle Chief Dark Horse

You see them here first. Hot off the Indian Motorcycle photographer camera, these are the first 2 pictures of the new 2010 Indian Chief Dark Horse. As you can see, the Chief Dark Horse is a dark, sinister, mechanical looking motorcycle with a smoke “matte” finish and will be also available in Thunder Black, Indian Red and Deep Water Blue. The colored headdress on the tank is a new twist on the colored versions of the past. The dark components on the bike including the blacked out headlight, tappet blocks, suspension, engine components, exhaust system, and hand controls make the remaining chrome components stand out. MSRP is $27,999 and you will be able to see it in Sturgis at the Buffalo Chip where Indian Motorcycle will be setup.


Chiefs feature a 105 cubic inch PowerPlus V-Twin powertrain with electronic closed loop sequential port fuel injection. Engine cylinders are Nikasil plated and the stainless stell exhaust system is an integrated 3-way catalytic converter with heated oxygen sensors.  A six-speed Baker transmission delivers power through the belt drive. Stopping is achieved via Brembo 4-piston calipers, with 11.5” dual rotors up front. Standard 5.5-gallon tank helps extend cruising range. Seats are all-leather and built to exacting specifications. If you ask me, a Great Indian Model. Indian Motorcycle


84 Responses to “Breaking News. First Pictures Of The 2010 Indian Motorcycle Chief Dark Horse”

  1. 1 Brandon Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:14 pm

    Thanks Cyril. This bike is superb. Indian new owners begin to understand bikers taste. They should have done this model for their 1st year. Price is very attractive too. Half of a Kiwi Indian with a better warranty (nothing against Kiwi). It’s killer

  2. 2 tattooeddmike Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:19 pm

    Sharp Indian, I like the blacked-out look. Cheaper in price than a straight Chief, but at $28,000 plus taxes and dealer fees????? ….. a lot of bucks. Still with the 105″ motor and the Baker 6-speed and with preimum Brembo brakes, NICE,….. Very Nice…

  3. 3 Jeremy Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:25 pm

    Going to take quite a few sales from Harley…Harley needs good competition to lose their arrogance. So, it’s great. Would look good also with the short fenders option of the classic models. Why not?

  4. 4 Patrick Henry Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:41 pm

    Great job on this one Indian.

  5. 5 Grayhawk Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:45 pm

    I do so like the blacked out look.


  6. 6 Wolf13 Jul 13th, 2009 at 12:53 pm

    Hey Cyril, you scooped everybody again. Say to Indian that with these 2 new models they are believable again. even more when they will do a Scout at 12K.

  7. 7 Doug Gates Jul 13th, 2009 at 1:55 pm

    Need to lower the price! A 1999 Drifter 1500 would be a lot cheaper!

  8. 8 Doug Gates Jul 13th, 2009 at 1:57 pm

    They should try blacking out the motor, exhaust, shocks and have the tank and fenders with bright colors…the look is very sharp! Just look at a 1999 Kawsaki Drifter 1500!!

  9. 9 Chief Waldo Jul 13th, 2009 at 2:58 pm

    Wow. An all black bike. Like that’s never been done before.

  10. 10 Art Welch Jul 13th, 2009 at 3:12 pm

    If the short fender is available on all the other models.. it will more than likely be available on on this model as well. Just wait until some of you see this in person. Not anything like the picture, but BETTER.

  11. 11 Dustin King Jul 13th, 2009 at 6:23 pm

    Flat black paint jobs are a gimmick, but it works well to help move bikes. See Harley Dark Series. It’s not cheap but I know that it’s better finished than a Harley. You should not customize it, Just keep the way it comes out of the Indian factory.

  12. 12 rdawsoniii Jul 13th, 2009 at 7:27 pm

    I can’t wait to see what the Indian red looks like.

    I personally don’t care for flat finishes, but I like the headdress on the tank. They should make that available on their other models.

  13. 13 John Breard Jul 13th, 2009 at 8:10 pm

    To dress up a Kawa like an Indian motorcycle? What a clown you are. Why not dressing up an Indian or a Harley in a Kawa. Do you wear a fake Piaget or a fake Rolex? Or maybe just a Mickey watch.

  14. 14 Brett Jul 13th, 2009 at 8:49 pm

    I like it, but still…$27,000???? & that’s with no touring bags or anything? The new Indian is still not an every man’s bike.

  15. 15 Raymond Jul 13th, 2009 at 9:01 pm

    At this point I don’t think that Indian wants to be every man’s bike. It would have been a mistake for them to build a cheaper bike with the risk of so so components. They have to fight the poor Indian image left by Gilroy. They want to be profitable with a solid high end product. Later, I guess with a rebuilt good image and credibility it will be the time to pursue the average income biker. I say 2 or 3 years before we see a 15 K Indian bike. BTW, Harley is not the every’s man bike..

  16. 16 Rondha Jul 13th, 2009 at 9:14 pm

    Indian found its marketing niche. Good luck to them.

  17. 17 Jim Sheenan Jul 13th, 2009 at 10:34 pm

    Pretty cool. Now Kiwi is limited to restorations. No more clones.. I hate Harley and Indian clones. 27 K is in my budget, it’s a genuine Indian and few will be made. Will check it out in Sturgis and I may order one in black like the pics.

  18. 18 Bobcat Jul 13th, 2009 at 11:16 pm

    Hey Doug… need I remind you this is an AMERICAN Indian Motorcycle not some Japaneese copy you can have the Drifter I want the original… Indian Americas First Motorcycle

  19. 19 Daany C Flucke Jr Jul 14th, 2009 at 12:51 am

    I like it. But not as much as the “Midnight Sun” prototype Gilroy was working on.

    Make a few in gloss black and watch which ones sell first………..

    Work hard and ride safe, Thanx, Danny

  20. 20 Woody Jul 14th, 2009 at 6:44 am

    Wow, coming on the heels of the “cartoonish” Bomber model of a prvious blog entry-what a sharp looking bike! I can see Bomber owners lining up to get the indianhead/headress decal to replace the one one on their bike. Out of my price range right now, but if the quality and service/support are there maybe I can get a used one in a few years 😉
    Well done!

  21. 21 Icy Jul 14th, 2009 at 7:47 am

    No TX dealership ????
    Just keep the gov. and Hussian away from Indian and let it roll.

  22. 22 FiremanDave Jul 14th, 2009 at 8:39 am

    Bring a dealership to Texas and I’ll Buy it!

  23. 23 Vintage Jul 14th, 2009 at 8:54 am

    American made, by a British company , sorry but the EFI doesnt work , the bike is just another rehashed Gilroy , sorry but do to contrary belief every single part is rechangeable with the Gilroy bikes , which were better made (before they went under) ! This company wont survive! Not at the outlandish prices , of course most people in this economy who have money to burn, dont plan on riding motorcycles anyway , so buying as a collector is fine I guess, want a much better bike with a proven record,? Seek out Harley, Honda, Yamaha and host of others , go to an Indian dealer and find out just how little the dealers know about there own bikes , its amazing! Pure rubbish !

  24. 24 Indian Rider Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:12 am

    THERE IS a Texas Dealer in Dallas. And yes the EFI works! Sounds like “Vintage” simply can’t afford one! And no, Indian is not every mans bike.. Harley would be closer to that.. Insecure people that buy Harley because they feel like they need to be part of something. Not everyone Can afford an Indian back in the gilroy Era or now..

  25. 25 J. Barnes Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:14 am

    Vintage. Your comments are 100% BS. 1- Indian is an American company where some investors are English. 2- The EFI works perfect. I have 2 friends owning one. 3- Gilroy bikes are unanimously recognized as having a lot of defects, reason why they went under. Make an online search and you will see. You can’t replace the new new Indian parts with Gilroy parts because all KM Indian parts are 100% new for their bikes. And anyway who would want to do this except a crazy guy like you? Why don’t you write under your name? I am certain you have an agenda because…(You are in OK, right?). Go to ride your vintage, your Honda and your Yamaha and don’t stop on this website to list all your BS..

  26. 26 terminator Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:17 am

    it´s a view of parts from:
    Nacelle from HD-Road-King
    Frontfork from HD-Fatboy
    Seat from HD-Fatboy
    Fender from Arlen Ness

    what is it`a partcopy ?

    best regards michael

    see Midnight Runner from Cyril Huze, that is design.

  27. 27 M.Heinzen Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:19 am

    it´s a view of parts from:
    nacelle from HD-Road-King
    Frontfork from HD-Fatboy
    Seat from HD-Fatboy

    it´is a mix from all.

    not my bike.

  28. 28 Geno Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:24 am

    flat black is so 2 years ago “rat rod”
    Harley has even pulled the color it out of their line and Harley is usually a year behind the curve of what’s happening in the hot rod market…
    They dont want to make a everyday mans bike????-bahh
    the heavy hitter doctors, lawyers, badass liberals, and indian chiefs (no pun) are not buying bikes now
    they are mostly stuck with their big tired (pun intended) Texas choppers in the garage next to their Lexus and worrying about how to make the mort. payment

    For Indian to survive they need a cool entry level single cylinder bike for about $5,000
    easy on the eye, easy to ride, fast, easy to customize, easy to buy, easy to find a dealer etc-aim it at young guys who want to ride-give it 2 seats so he can pick up a girl with it
    like Honda did in 1963 -build small, make a market and then build bigger

    They need to finally realize its not all about trendy pop culture “make a quick” buck bull shit

    I hope they last least a few years

  29. 29 J Jul 14th, 2009 at 10:13 am

    Geno- LOL!!! “entry level single cylinder bike for about $5000?”

    Umm, yeah- good luck with THAT grasp on reality!

    Oh wait- my bad- they DO make your dream bike- it even has a fancy name… “Vespa”……

  30. 30 Shifter Jul 14th, 2009 at 10:34 am

    Geno. What do you smoke? Why don’t you ask your builders friends to build you a brand new street legal bike for 5K with a 2-year warranty. Then send the pic to Cyril so that we can laugh looking at it. You can do it yourself too!.

  31. 31 Karen Jul 14th, 2009 at 11:28 am

    Indian Rider ,
    No one can locate a dealer in Dallas,TX.


  32. 32 Icy Jul 14th, 2009 at 11:32 am

    M.Heinzen ,

    You mean the HarleyBama ?

  33. 33 Lyle Jul 14th, 2009 at 12:36 pm

    Say, don’t be saying anything bad about Vespa. They are the most iconic brand in the scooter business with an establised reputation and style. There’s been more than one new motorcycle manufacturer trying to bring back some of the old brands to the same level Vespa enjoys now.

    Speaking of the new Indian comapany and single cylinder intro bikes, at least they are now repeating the mistakes of the 60’s and 70’s by badge engineering Velocettes, two stroke dirt bikes, and mopeds. But even back then, some people claimed they were real Indians too.

    At least the new Indian is building an American made V-Twin albeit with a Harley Davidson designed drivetrain and other components. I think they are going in the right direction with this model but to me, it’s still a Harley Hybred rather than an Indian. I wish the company well and know that sometime in the future they will introduce their own Indian inspired engine and drivetrain with Semi unit construction, twin cam, and a 42 degree V, just like the originals. I realize that if Indian had continued from 53 until now, they would have developed OHV, EFI, Disk Brakes, and many other modern features this bike has, but it wouldn’t be a Harley clone which is what this bike is. Having said that, they are moving in the right direction. It’s nice to see them move away from the over chromed bling bling that some of their first models hyped. Good Move!

  34. 34 PETE AND MAUREEN Jul 14th, 2009 at 3:02 pm

    If you think the pictures are great, wait until you see the real thing!!! We recently attended a dealer meeting in Kings Mountain, NC for the unveling of the Dark Horse and Bomber series bikes. The Dark Horse is the most stealth-looking motorcycle you’ve seen in a long, long time. We are the Indian Motorcycle dealer in New Jersey (Indian Motorcycle North Jersey). We’ve been in this business for 32 years and can tell you that not only do these bikes have incredibly good looks, but ride and handle magnificently! The two new models only enhance the existing product line. If any of you are in our area we invite you to visit and test ride the new Indian Chief.

  35. 35 David Jul 14th, 2009 at 3:51 pm

    Nothing new here! Just how many ways can you use Flat Blat Krylon and tell someone it’s new and exciting. I would like to see new and great colers that everyone can call their own and be distinctive to the brand!!!!

  36. 36 Strokerz Jul 14th, 2009 at 4:33 pm

    David. Only the bad backyard builders use a flat black Krylon spray can. It’s not the way to do a correct flat black to make it as strong as paint with multi clear coats. I bet you don’t know how to do it. Do you sincerely think that Indian use Krylon spray cans? Lol.

  37. 37 Primo Jul 14th, 2009 at 6:42 pm

    I, personally, can not wait to purchase an Indian. However, being a bit more expensive, it may take a little longer. I’m tired of Harley Davidson building crap and not taking responsibility for their mistakes. I was wanting to buy a Screaming Eagle Ultra, but not with the 110″ piece of crap they put on them. I’m also thrilled you have the smarts to put a Baker 6 speed tranny instead of trying to make your own. Indian, I hope you are able to make a permanent go in this market and economy, cause you sure got one dis-gruntled Harley owner here that can’t wait to get out of that market

  38. 38 Brett Jul 14th, 2009 at 6:55 pm

    Raymond, not every man may like Harley, but their bikes start at $6,995. You also have to get into one of the Screaming Eagle bikes for a Harley to go over $20,000 list. This $27,000 Chief doesn’t even have bags or a windshield, so it’s hard to call it a touring bike.

    As far as Indian being a threat to Harley, not right now they aren’t. What did they sell, like 7,000 to 10,000 bikes last year? If anything, they are taking the Big Dog & Iron Horse people with their prices.

    Right now Indian isn’t selling a 3rd the bikes Harley is. If they last, & if Harley keeps going the way they are, well one day in about 5 years or so, there may be a real competition between them again. Wouldn’t that be ironic if Harley folded & Indian stuck around??? I doubt it will happen because I am sure if the clowns running HD don’t get it together, someone else will step in & maybe there will be a coupe again.

    Anyway, I like the bike & am stopping at the Twin Cities Indian dealership this weekend to check things out.

  39. 39 Indian Rider Jul 14th, 2009 at 7:43 pm

    Karen.. go to and click at the top where it says dealers.. and look at the map. should be on there. this is for the Texas Dealer.

  40. 40 Indian Rider Jul 14th, 2009 at 7:44 pm

    My goof.. they will be opening here shortly! Same owner as the one in Wichita!

  41. 41 ROB Jul 15th, 2009 at 12:18 pm


  42. 42 Conrad Nicklus Jul 16th, 2009 at 1:34 pm

    Seriously some of you all are complete idiots. You boast about how Harleys are an average persons bike and how far ahead Indians are. Come on, if they are so far ahead of Harley why do they still look like the 30s and 40s? I have no problem with that but to me they are reproductions of the originals and I hate replicas. At least Harley has maintained a criteria while still shooting their guns at past models and continuously changing their model line up with new looks year after year. They change paint ideas, bags, fender, engines etc. Indian has stuck with all the same looks and added some updated technology. They still sounds weak, still look old and still will go out of business within 7 years.

    I am not saying I like Harley because I dont, But I will say that its bullshit how some of ya’ll come on here and start saying how you wont be able to get your hands on Indians because they are selling liek hotcakes and how Harley is a typical motorcyclists motorcycle and the only people who buy them are insecure and must feel like a part of a group. That is all bullshit. Some of the case that is true but we have several customers who buy just as many Harleys as they do our bikes and it is because they love the sport of riding and already belong to themseleves, thus meaning they are secure.

  43. 43 John White Jul 17th, 2009 at 3:48 pm

    Response to this mis-informed post:

    J. Barnes
    Jul 14th, 2009 at 9:14 am
    Vintage. Your comments are 100% BS. 1- Indian is an American company where some investors are English. 2- The EFI works perfect. I have 2 friends owning one. 3- Gilroy bikes are unanimously recognized as having a lot of defects, reason why they went under. Make an online search and you will see. You can’t replace the new new Indian parts with Gilroy parts because all KM Indian parts are 100% new for their bikes. And anyway who would want to do this except a crazy guy like you? Why don’t you write under your name? I am certain you have an agenda because…(You are in OK, right?). Go to ride your vintage, your Honda and your Yamaha and don’t stop on this website to list all your BS..

    Dear Indian Riders:

    Indian is owned by Stellican, a private investment company based in England. The EFI does not work perfectly. Indian is aware of this and is working on it. The early Gilroy bikes had many defects; most of them reported (see recalls). The 2002 Chief was an all new bike with a mono-shock frame and 100 cubic inch engine. These new engines had many problems. However, once the engine is fixed the bike is as good or better than the 09 bikes.

    I own one of the first 2009 Chiefs. I have allowed many folks to ride the bike and we have clocked nearly 10,000 miles now. Not one person has liked the fuel injection programming. I could go into it in detail but not here. We have reported the issues of the new bikes honestly and fairly. We have suffered engine casting failures due to leaking castings, oil pump failures, and other issues. All of them quickly addressed by the new Indian thank you very much. We also recently suffered from a broken fork stop which Indian is also addressing.

    With regards to interchangeability, I own seven 2002 to 2003 Gilroy Chiefs. I have also made several bikes using the left over Gilroy frames and I also own all the Gilroy drawings of Gilroy, including the frame drawings. I own the engine molds and manufacture the engine. I can tell you first hand that the frames are the same, all parts are interchangeable. This is good news for “we” Gilroy owners. I can tell you that Indian does not have a parts manual yet. However, the parts manual from the Gilroy bikes works fine for now. Indian is working on this too.

    I was once the largest critic of the new Indian. However, since I purchased the new bike I have experienced many issues…….all of them quickly addressed. While I am disappointed I am not unhappy. Why? Because I am thankful there is an Indian dealer and I understand that new products are going to have issues. I do not think the price is too high. They are losing money making these bikes. Thank god they are opening dealerships. I support them 100%. I report everything in the name of improving the bike.

    The front suspension is far better than the Gilroy bike. The front brakes are better too. The gas tank is one piece and warns of low fuel. The dash is slightly changed but will drop right onto a Gilroy…….and so will the new tank with minor mounting changes. The handlebars are Jap so the controls are Jap. No big deal but I like the old school controls of the Gilroy. The handlebars on the Gilroy 04 were going to be Jap…….yes the same exact controls you see on the 09. So if you like old school you have to take parts off. The swing arm is the same. The rear belt is a bit narrower due to putting a larger rear tire on the back. The rear shock and pivot points are unchanged from Gilroy. The fenders and seats wheels and everything else has the same exact mounting. The engine cases are made from the same exact molds as the late Gilroy……….yes, the same molds left over from Gilroy. Indian improved the oil pump, the oil pump schematic is different but the oil tank is the same exact tank that mounts under the transmission and yes, even that is interchangeable. The foot controls are the same too with some slight difference in the diameter…..Gilroy being larger and more beefy looking.

    Overall I like the bike. It’s a good start.

    Quoting that you know everything just because your friend owns one is more BS than anything Vintage could say. On that note I do appreciate your efforts to support Indian. Let’s cut the BS on both sides. If you cannot afford one or do not wish to buy one then take my bike and go ride the thing and then tell us what you think.


    John L. White
    IRG West Coast
    USMC 1973-77

  44. 44 Brandon Jul 17th, 2009 at 4:07 pm

    Jim White and Vintage. Same person!!!! Ha, ha. It removes all credibility.

  45. 45 Matt Jul 17th, 2009 at 4:28 pm

    Vulcan, what the #%&*!!!… Doug Gates stand down. You too Vintage. I would rather push my Indian than be caught on a Honda or Yamaha… Harley’s are just cheap imitations, have been since 1903.

  46. 46 Jim Jul 17th, 2009 at 6:23 pm

    Brandon mentions Jim…who the fudge is JIM? If you meant JOHN as was clearly written then you are wronger than your parents when they chose not to abort you.

  47. 47 Halstad Blanchard Jul 17th, 2009 at 11:49 pm


    You are so full of SH__! The 09 Indian uses totally different cylinders in that engine…(No Sleeves) No de-lamination like the Gilroy cylinders…… The fuel injection is all chocked up to be 49 state legal and you know that! After-market will catch up soon enough…. 03 bikes are better the a relay-less electrical system….? (Like the 09’s) Baker six speed is equal to the Chinese 5 speed in the 03’s…. I work those Gilroy bikes every day of my life and they can be Sh__ Boxes until thousands of dollars are spent to make them right! I own one and I am loyal to Indian….But get real! The 09 bikes are by far superior then the 03’s

  48. 48 SID8D Jul 18th, 2009 at 2:54 am

    I know of 2 owners of the new 2009 Indians localy. Both bikes have been back in the dealer for electrical issues, leaky forks, and a few other issues. I am sorry but that sounds a bit like the old Gilroys to me.
    Saying that because the cylinders are different makes it a totally different bike is silly at best. I would take Mr. White up on his offer to tear into that bike a bit and you may gain a new perspective.

  49. 49 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 4:15 am

    Response to: Halstad Blanchard

    With regards to the cylinders you might take a close look and see that Ramsden makes the cylinders. Same as the Gilroy era. True, they enlarged the bore by removing the sleeves. Not saying that is a bad idea but I am saying those parts fit the Gilroy engine. So do the all S&S parts inside. I can tell you the Gilroy bike will smoke the new 09. The five speed was made in Korea, not China, and if you do your homework you might find many things on the new 09 made in Korea……… big deal. With regards to the 09 being better than the 03’s, well that is a matter of opinion. I like my 09 but I also like my 03 Vintage. They are both nice. I paid 38K for my 09 and there is no way I got that much in my Vintage. From ten feet away most are going to choose the Vintage over the 09 due to the looks. Ride them both for a while and then you might have a different opinion. I think you got the wrong impression. I said I like my 09. Yea, the six speed is nice too. I put six speeds in all my bikes….right side drive too. Can we have a civil conversation? I back my statements with facts. Not trying to get into a fight with ya, just trying to point out a few things. You brought up a couple of good points, thanks.

  50. 50 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 4:21 am

    By the way, John White and Vintage are not the same person. My name is John White and I live in Seattle and own a company named Crazy Horse Motorcycles and also American Pile Driving Equipment ( Vintage is a guy named Don. He lives in OK. He is about 6’10” tall and a former Marine like me. He is also a member of the Leathernecks MC. Bad ass dude that I would not try to screw with. He owns a Vintage and is not too keen on the new Indian. I cannot change his mind, no one can. To each his own. I support Indian.

  51. 51 Patrick Henry Jul 18th, 2009 at 8:13 am

    John White. You have no credibility whatsoever. Your business is about trying to fix the Gilroy bikes. Your business is seriously threatened by the New Indian dealers. They can also fix the Gilroy bikes They are lemon and you know it very well. The new KM 09 Indian are 10 times superior, whatever you say. Are you one of those who predicted here that KM Indian will not be able to launch, will never produce a bike, will never have a dealer? You didn’t think one second what you said at the time. You just tried to use this website to lunch rumors. It’s again what you are doing with your biased statements again Indian. You just try to support your business by badmouthing the New Indian. Your attitiude betrays your difficulties. You are just a very bitter person. .

  52. 52 SID8D Jul 18th, 2009 at 8:33 am

    Mr. Henry- It would appear that between you and Mr. White, you are the only one doing any attacking here. How does your 2009 ride? Have you had any issues with it? Have you turned a wrench on it yet? Crazy Horse has done much to keep us Gilroy owners on the road.
    And the issues that Mr. White is reporting can be validated by Indian themselves if you would like to drop them a call. That makes his statements fact. Now how about we all get back to talking about the bikes and not attacking Mr. White?

  53. 53 Halstad Blanchard Jul 18th, 2009 at 9:35 am

    JW has done what……….? You mean, taken Indian to court to try and stop them from building bikes…True that…….You mean offered bounties and rewards so he could find who is talking bad about him? You mean he has helped the countless people who he has threatened to sue……Get a life JW has made lots and lots of enemies in the Indian Motorcycle world!

  54. 54 Indian Freddy Jul 18th, 2009 at 9:57 am

    John White/Crazy Horse Motorcycles. Good bye…

  55. 55 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 1:03 pm

    Halstad Blanchard:

    Where did you get the idea that I took Indian to court to prevent them from making bikes? Not true. No matter. We are talking about 09 Indians. I own one. I have my comments without attacking you personally. This blog is not about attacking people personally. I have made some comments about my 09. I stated that I like the motorcycle. I have reported some issues but I have also pointed out that Indian has quickly taken care of them. Folks buying these bikes need to know the problems and also know that Indian is there to fix them. Indian is alive and well. They listen, they want to hear about these issues. They are responding. That is a good sign of a good company.

    With regards to issues on motorcycles one can look at the many, many recalls on Harley. Brake failures, transmission issues, wiring, you name it. All manufacturers suffer problems. I look at whether the manufacturer can supply parts and service. Indian can do this and that is what I am reporting. I am considering very seriously about opening Indian Seattle. At this time we are supplying parts and service to Indian dealers. They are offering service to Gilroy owners and we are supporting them with engine rebuilds and complete new engines. Regardless of what you believe, we are supporting Indian with all we got. I will put my money where my mouth is. If you can find any documents where I sued Indian to stop building motorcycles as you claim, I will pay you ten thousand dollars in cash and post the documents. I am asking you please to stop making false claims about me and stop attacking me personally. I will be at Indian KM next week. If you want to sit down and clear this false information I would be happy meet with you.


    John L. White

  56. 56 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 1:25 pm

    To Patrick Henry:

    I would like to comment about what you said in your post. First, I have several businesses. If Crazy Horse failed today it would not change my life style. With regards to creditability, well you can Google that. Yes, we are about helping Gilroy PowerPlus owners. However, as you may have seen, most of our customers are custom bike builders. I do not view the Gilroy bikes as lemons. The sport the same frame and geometry as the new bikes. Gilroy rushed an engine program and that engine had some major bugs that have taken me over 5 years to fix. Sleeve issues, too much compression, machining errors, you name it. Jerry Correct, the person that designed the engine, suffered through many issues trying to get this engine off the ground in such a short time. Nevertheless, we fixed it.

    Most, if not all Gilroy owners love their bikes and do not see them as lemons as you call them. You make a point about the 09’s being ten times better…………well you might be right. When I purchased my 03 the head gaskets blew the first week. On my 09 the engine cases leaked oil through the castings and had to be replaced. The difference was that when my head gaskets failed I returned the bike and Indian was closed. With my 09 the factory shipped the bike back to KM and replaced the castings and that bike now has ten thousand miles on it so you might be right, the 09 is ten times better. In each case the bikes are Indian and I see no reason to have conflict over whether Gilroy was better or KM is better. They are both Indians. What makes them ten times better is the fact that dealers are open and providing service, not to mention the many improvements such as the fuel tank, primary, hydraulic clutch, five more cubes, better charging system, larger rear tire, better forks, better brakes, windshield mounts, key system, and many other items. Yea, you might be right………..the new bikes are ten times better………and they are getting better by the minute. The 2010, which this blog is all about, is another example that Indian lives.

  57. 57 Halstad Blanchard Jul 18th, 2009 at 1:58 pm

    You never had Indian in Court in Denver? Federal Court? You never left a bounty out there to find out who posted things about you? Come on JW. We all know the truth. The question is do you? Your memory is getting a bit selective these days!

  58. 58 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 2:21 pm

    Conrad Nicklus,

    The Gilroy Indian Chief and the new KM Indian may have some Harley features but this bike is much different than a Harley. First off, it is eight inches longer than a Road King. The bike is perfect for the big and tall. If you are over six feet tall you do not belong on a Harley. Harley fits a 1950’s size man and that worked then but more and more folks are too tall to fit on that short bike. Yea, you can move things around but the fact is…………….it is too short for tall riders.

    The second thing to point out is the suspension. The Indian Chief has a mono shock rear suspension which is superior to that soft tail gadget suspension system with regards to travel.

    I do not want to bash Harley. They are a giant compared to Indian. Everywhere you look you see a Harley. Indian riders are thinkers that wish to be different and not follow the crowd. You can say the Indian bike is just a Harley clone but this is not true. It has big……….tall…………and with real features not found on a Harley. Most Harley owners have a fear that Indian will come back and their feelings are justified. Men do not like to look up to other men but if you ride a Harley and you park next to an Indian you can bet you are looking up.

    One thing you will notice about Gilroy and KM Chief riders……………they tower over Harley riders in height. If you see a guy on a Harley that is over six feet tall then let him know he should be riding the longer, more comfortable Indian.

  59. 59 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 2:25 pm

    Halstad Blanchard

    No, never been in a Denver court and no to your other false claims. I think you have me confused with Richard Block who indeed had many cases in Denver against CMA and IMC. Sorry to say but you are grossly mistaken. My ten thousand dollar offer stands.

  60. 60 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 2:44 pm

    Back to the 2010 Indian. A fine example on how a bike’s looks can change dramatically with the right paint scheme. Wow, that bike is Stealthy cool. In addition to the paint I notice a trick looking design on the exhaust that is an added eye catcher.

  61. 61 Halstad Blanchard Jul 18th, 2009 at 3:37 pm

    You can keep your money. I know the truth!

  62. 62 yahweh Jul 18th, 2009 at 6:30 pm

    JW can keep his money alright, can you keep your mouth shut?

  63. 63 John White Jul 18th, 2009 at 7:56 pm

    Dear Halstad Blanchard,

    I thought you were going to open up a dealership in North Dakota? Rather than take shots at me lets hear how its going with that dealership. Regardless of your attacks I wish you well with that venture. We need a few more dealers.

  64. 64 r.alan Jul 18th, 2009 at 10:19 pm

    Mr.White: Will the PP100 Engine bolt into a 2001 Centennial Chief frame? If so, is there clearance for the oil filter on the back of the engine block between the engine and the transmission, or is a remote oil filter needed?

    Thank you.

  65. 65 John White Jul 19th, 2009 at 11:41 am

    Dear R.alan:

    Yes, the PP100 or as we call it, the V-Plus………..fits in all Gilroy frames including the Scout frames.

    To give you some history, we needed someone to test our engine years ago. We provided an engine to a guy named Mike Rock (and many others). Mike rides his 2000 Chief 60 miles to work and 60 miles home each day in L.A. traffic. His S&S blew up so we thought he would be a perfect guy to test our engine. We gave him one on condition that he would report his experiences. When we first purchased the engine program we thought we corrected everything but this engine test program showed that we had issues even beyond what everyone was aware of. Our program required that we inspect the engine at 20K. It was a mess. Mainly the compression ratio. Gilroy had mistakenly thought the compression ratio was 9.5 to 1 but it was actually more than 11-to 1. They did not do their math right. It turned out the combustion chambers were too small (81 to 83 cc) and needed to be enlarged to 90 cc’s to drop the compression to the desired 9.5 to 1. Anyway, our first engines went out with this higher compression ratio and suffered head gasket failures and caused starter failures and we learned that at about 20,000 miles they were used up. This we learned from several test riders buy mostly from Mike Rock because he rides so many miles. So we lowered the compression along with many other problems. Mike Rock loves his engine and continues to report and will comment further on this blog later.

    You do not need a remote oil filter. Mike Rock has written a small essay about all the necessary things one must change to get the engine in the bike. The carb is on the left so you need to change these things which is about it. We also provided Rock with a six speed transmission which I highly recommend. We also provided him all the necessary parts to convert to a wet clutch but that was much later in the test program. He is glad to be rid of the dry clutch. We also provided him with a new ignition but at first he used his same ignition that was on his S&S.

    You can get one of our engines from us directly. However, you can get them through the Wichita Indian dealer. We also take your broken S&S in on trade and give you a new engine with a two year unlimited mile warranty for a total of $2500 dollars. Mike Rock loves to talk to anyone about his experiences and his conversion. We just had a Lone Wolf meeting in OK and he rode the bike all the way from California and took the record for the longest distance rider at that meeting. I rode his bike while he rode my 09 Indian. I love his bike and that 100 cubic inches makes his bike a real runner. Mike can be reached at 858 882 2156. He is one of many that are riding V-Plus engines in the early Gilroy bikes. In addition, Blackhawk, Jam. Ltd, both specializing in PP100 rebuilding, have provided engines to Gilroy owners. You can find Blackhawk and Jam. Ltd (Malfa) on our web site. They are listed as our distributors. They can provide engines also. Good Luck.

    Final note: Indian does plan to sell their 105’s and make them available to Gilroy owners. This engine is fuel injected and does require a larger charging system and ignition system. It will not be cheap. We make a fuel injected V-Plus using the Thunderheart system but our main program is with a carb. It will be nice to see Indian offering this new engine because it seems to be a winner. I have nearly ten thousand miles on my 09. Indian says it will be a couple of years before they can offer the engine. We sell most of our engines to custom bike builders so we welcome and encourage Indian to offer the new 105 engines to Gilroy owners.


    John L. White

  66. 66 r.alan Jul 19th, 2009 at 5:49 pm

    Dear Mr. White:

    Thank you for the information. My S&S is running good in and of itself, but currently,no pun intended, there seems to be a problem with the ignition system. I bought this bike second hand with 15,500 miles 0n it and now have about 18,500 miles, 3,000 miles give or take in about 4 months. I bought it in South Carolina and rode it home to Illinois last October. It had been sitting awhile so it smelled bad for the first several hours of riding and really didn’t start running half way decent until I hit Tennesse. It was bucking and spitting somewhat under acceleration and didn’t want to run over 65 mph. The engine also died a few times at highway speed and then backfired when it kicked back on. Also the battery would not stay charged, so after jumping it several times I just left it running for about 11 and 1/2 hours straight. The right gas cap would not come off either so I had to refuel every 120 or so miles. What a first ride.

    Four batteries, one rectifier, eight or so spark plugs, a starter, and some minor wiring repair later…lol…I’ve about got it whipped!

    My next upgrade will probably be a single fire coil and crank trigger and a set of pipes, probably from Hacker as they seem to perform well with these 88″ engines.

    If my budget will permit it, I would love to have one of the 100″ engines and a 6 speed transmission. Maybe this winter. Anyway, once again, thank you sir very much.

    Sincerely, R.Alan

    P.S. All that being said. I wouldn’t give this bike up for anything…It’s an INDIAN and it’s mine.

  67. 67 Michael Rock Jul 20th, 2009 at 9:49 am

    R. Alan,

    I ran a Dyna 2000i on my S&S 88 for quite some time. At the time, however, I did not have a laptop computer and could not program it other than the pre-set curves. I have found with the V-Plus from Crazy Horse that fine tuning the ignition curves is a must.

    If you do choose to go with the V-Plus from Crazy Horse, call me any time at (858) 449-3069 (my mobile number) and I can help you through all of the ups and downs.

    An oil cooler is a must if you switch, we installed a porsche style cooler on my 2000 chief and it works like a champ. As for the fitment, you may need to adjust the upper motor mount (provided with the V-Plus) but everything else bolts right up.

    A couple of notes: The stock exhaust from the 1999-2001 should not be used on the V-Plus. The front cylinder head pipe rides against the cam cover and overheats the stock ignition, killing the trigger. The stock exhaust from 2002-2003 is required, or a good aftermarket exhaust like the RB Racing exhaust from RSR racing.

    If you have a dry clutch setup, it can be used. I highly recommend moving to a wet primary though, a lot less noise and much more reliable. With the V-Plus you can use several different ignitions. Stock indian or cone style (make your choice when ordering your engine.)

    As John said, we have been through 2 motors so far. The first one had issues due to high compression. The current motor is still running strong and, properly tuned, making for one very happy test rider.

    Good luck, call me if you have any questions on the V-Plus or if you need any assist with your S&S.

  68. 68 John White Jul 20th, 2009 at 4:50 pm

    I forgot about that RB Racing exhaust and how it very much improved the performance of the V-Plus. RB Racing’s exhaust is available through Jam. LTD (Joe Malfa). We dyno tested many different exhaust configurations and the RB Racing exhaust performed the best. Rock can tell you about the massive fuel mile improvement using the Doherty Products air cleaner system.

    Back to the 09……………the primary is vastly different with regards to width and has less oil capacity. You have to look at the two side by side to see the differences. The good news is that the new primary is also interchangeable with the Gilroy bikes. The inner primary on the Gilroy did have what I call design issues. Not good or bad but you cannot remove the stator without removing the inner primary. What a hassle! The new 09 primary still has this issue. Early Harley suffered from these same design issues but later addressed it and re-designed their inner primary to allow the stator to be removed. I hope Indian addresses this issue on later models.

    John White

  69. 69 Brett Jul 20th, 2009 at 8:44 pm

    Went to the Indian Dealership in St. Paul this weekend. 1st, pictures on the internet DO NOT do the Indians justice. These are good looking bikes & are not cheaply made at all. They have the best of the best on them. For anyone to say they using Fatboy front ends or what have you would be incorrect.

    However, back to my main issue & that is the price. The cheapest Chief is $27,000 plus. If in St. Paul, all you have to do is go across the parking lot & you are at the St. Paul HD. No matter what you want to say, the Chief Roadmaster & Vintage look alot more like a Heritage Softail then they do even the Electra Glide Standard. They have leather bags & what looks like a detachable windshield. They list for $34,000.

    The Electra Glide Standard has hard bags & a fairing. They go for $17,000. The fairing gives you the option to add a stereo. Half the price for what would seem to be a bit more bike.

    I am not a touring bike guy, so bags & windshields do little for me.

    Just when you put the 2 next to each other & one is twice the price & the only thing they can tell you is you will be treated like a king by Indian & not like one of the faceless HD, well yeah for $34,000 I’d hope for good treatment. They also said the lower number of bikes being made & sold will have it keeps it’s value, as they only wanted to sell 700 this year.

    The owner was also telling me Indian would like a dealer in every state, but they guaranteed him he’d be the only Indian dealer for three years in the Minnesota, Wisconsin & Illinois markets. A buyer could go to Michigan for a bike though.

    I wanted to ask him, did you get a guarantee Indian would be around in 3, 4 or even 10 years this time round?

    Like I said, beautiful bike & I really like this Dark Horse. Just might have to wait for them to hit Ebay before I think about buying one. Scouts & Spirits from the last time don’t go for more then $8,000 now.

  70. 70 r.alan Jul 20th, 2009 at 8:48 pm

    Thanks guys for the information, I appreciate it.

    I prefer the Indian Bomber over the Dark Horse. Green is my favorite colour and I tend more toward grey than black. Matte paint is easier to care for, that is a plus. Also my dad was in WW2 and he bought a ’47 Chief after he got home. Although this was way before my time I heard several stories of him and my mom riding this bike. Wish he kept it for me…oh well..

    Michael:I may give you a call at some point, thanks again.


  71. 71 Pop Jul 21st, 2009 at 6:44 am

    Pity this board is getting bogged down in some of the same old same old.
    Points up an often overlooked point. The passion for the Indian motorcycle runs as deep or deeper than its American counterpart or any of the offshore competition.
    Pop doesn’t think that there is anyplace that Indian riders won’t ultimately get down onto the mat over these critters.
    If it ain’t the current incarnation, it’s the last one or the one before that or the so on and so forth. Is a Euro-moped a rightful part of the lineage? After Springfield is any machine that has badged a chiefhead legit? Is the current machine worth the ducats? Was the Gilroy worth the ducats? Is it a Harley knock off? Was it defects of manufacture that killed Gilroy? Was it antiquated engineering that killed Springfield? Was there a conspiracy in the 90’s to sell the name to insiders? Do parts interchange?
    Man, the history is so deep and rich I swear it would make a better movie than The Worlds Fastest Indian and that would be hard to beat.
    There are no bulletproof rides. The flatties had a list of issues and any rider worth his salt knew to keep a tool roll in the bag. Same goes for Gilroy. I don’t believe KM has any particular magic that makes the new rides exempt from needing the efficacious application of remedial mechanical intervention from time to time. If an ’09 has not broken down the end of the sentence is…yet. Just because they sell these things without saddlebags doesn’t mean you don’t need saddlebags.
    To all my friends and bros that proudly fly the headdress I will put up with all of you and your pecadillos since at the core we get it, and I would hope that you can man up and put up with Pop’s picadellos for the same reason.
    To all of you who do not ride Indian, there’s a bunch of road, enough for all of us. If you can hold your water about my choice of ride then I guarantee you that I’ll hold mine about the mistakes you made in not choosing Indian.

  72. 72 John White Jul 21st, 2009 at 11:40 pm

    Well said Pop!

  73. 73 dro arzooian Aug 3rd, 2009 at 3:38 pm

    Ive been waiting for Indians for such a long time,finally I got tired and against my wheel bought a Harley fatboy and made it special,matt black finish and etc.
    Now I see my dream bike here,the same coloring as my Harley and I am speechless,I spent all my money for the Fat boy but i could have bought my dream bike instead.
    Ill buy it hopefully if I can get some money back from selling my Harley.
    Great job Indian.
    Harley is a legend,INDIAN IS A DREAM.

  74. 74 dro arzooian Aug 3rd, 2009 at 3:39 pm

    againd=st my will(I guess I was hypnotized with Indians new black wheels when I wrote that)

  75. 75 dro arzooian Aug 3rd, 2009 at 3:57 pm

    I just red some of the comments and I feel that i am in a room full of kids now.
    who cares what part of 09 is 03 or if harley is a better bike or worst.
    There is something that connects from each persons inside to a bike that no body can change it or logically proof the wrong and that connection is what make us feel the same or attached to a brand name.
    I my self should admit that there is nothing more beautiful and sexy to me than an Indian chief,all the curves,the look and The name it self is full of passion and I can feel every inch of it,I have a harley and eventhough its a very good looking bike and probably more reliable than an Indian but there is no comparison what I feel about an Indian.
    Grow up guys.lets ride our bikes side by side and instead of fighting eachother enjoy the beauty of open roads of our country with american build motorcycles.

  76. 76 Garry Jones Aug 10th, 2009 at 4:14 pm

    My wife has an 03 vintage, it s a great looking bike, but I have had the head gaskets replaced once and I think they are going again. When we were getting ready to leave for sturgis the bike wouldn’t start I think it may be the electronic ignition module. I live a couple hundred miles from Kent, Wa. Do you work on the vintage? I am interested in the upgrades that Black Hawk does, but it is a long ways from home. Thanks for any info

  77. 77 Dave Aug 12th, 2009 at 2:41 am

    I ride a 2003 Spirt Roadmaster, I love it. I saw all the new Indians in Sturgis “increadible” the red dark horse is a piece of art. I’ll own one

  78. 78 8-Ball Aug 15th, 2009 at 1:53 pm

    Looks good… but obviously they didn’t get the memo on Nikasil clad cylinders…

    Wouldn’t touch Nikasil on an air cooled with a ten foot pole…!!!!

    Ask around, there are tons of folks who got hosed on very expensive builds…

  79. 79 Woody218 Aug 15th, 2009 at 10:09 pm

    I agree on the Nikasil cylinders, just a very bad move on their part. I hope these bikes come with a hell of a good extended warranty, the owners are gonna need it!

  80. 80 Dan Aug 24th, 2009 at 9:56 pm

    Honestly, The only real reason why the Indian Is now in existance after going out in 1953 is because in 1996 the guys from cobra fabricated a late 40s Indian look alike using the base of a Kawasaki vulcan and then sending it to japan and that when the Drifter started. 99 to 05. and during that time,the U.S. greedy marketers quikly cameup with the Gilroy Indian which to me Is just a Harley -Davidson with Indian looking fenders and some extras. And that Is basically what Is going on with the new Company. Just another HD with Indian fenders and some extra Indian features but at a much higher price. What a scam!

  81. 81 George Aug 25th, 2009 at 6:02 pm

    I have been riding my 2003 Indian Vintage to Sturgis nearly every year from Seattle since I got it. No one has ever mistaken it for a Harley Davidson. The guys I ride with get tired of hearing the stories that folks come up with when they see my bike. They don’t ask them about their Harleys. It brings back memories and rekindles the passion of Indian. The bike is like no other and I have enjoyed the bike thoroughly. I have had issues like other folks with the electrical system and some unusual oil flow problems. It has been interesting working through the issues and creating a unique machine. I have about 33,000 miles on it and honestly most of it has been without a major problem. I did have a major problem this spring when a lifter failed. I have all the Malfa Performance modifications done to my engine. It is set up for torque and is a joy to ride. I have parked it the last two years with the new Indians at Sturgis the last two years. It looks good with them.
    I bent a pushrod coming back this year from Sturgis and it was a little inconvenient but, we got it fixed locally in Billings, Mt.
    We made our next destination of the LumberJack near LoLo Pass on schedule. You don’t get a dealer every 100 miles with an Indian. You better carry a cam trigger in your bags. If you prepare for the experience you will have a bike that reeks of the past and yet embraces enough technology to get you where you want at a comfortable pace. I will never regret having this bike. My daughter who rode with me this year said, “It wouldn’t be the same on anyother bike”. For me, it is going to be the ride of my life and I will ride it until I can’t anymore. Lots of bikes are cheaper and still alot of fun, but they are not an Indian.

  82. 82 napaho Sep 14th, 2009 at 3:58 pm

    Hey riders, Napaho here, I just came agross this site a few minutes ago and had to jump in on the fun. Some of these comments are hilarious Like the colonel said (Elvis Presely’s manager) doesn’t matter what they write as long as you are talked about. Good Luck to The new Indian Motorcycle Company. The bike looks great, I’m sure that the owners will be very proud and that is the way it should be. I thought only Harley riders condemned every other bike on the planet. I’ve owned and rode plenty of Vulcan Drifters (plastic Indian). They are great bikes as well. I know several original Indian motorcycle owners that own both. I’ve owned scouts, chiefs, and Drifters. I would love to won one of these new dark horses. I recently set my 10th land speed record at the Bonnefille Salt flats speedway this year on my 1946 Indian motorcycle in the Producrion vintage gas class. That would be my fourth land speed record on a vintage indian on the track. It might be slowest mph record my team holds. But like Rocky Robinson, Ack Attack’s pilot told me this year, a record is a record. He holds the record for the world’s fastest motorcycle at 360.913mph. I had the pleasure of helping Mike Tomas and his son Ross from Kiwi Indian motorcycle set their first land speed record. Ross is fifteen years old riding an 88 inch Indian in the modified vintage fuel class. Fun was had by all. By the way Burt Munro’s record is still posted on his streamliner special construction fuel class at 183.586 in 1967. I know people say that he went 206mph which is another urban myth. There is a great article on our ventures at or go to where you can link to Dreamcatcher Indian streamliner crew and the three part movie narrated by Jay Leno, Indian Wrecking Crew. By the Way my team is named the Bonneville Wrecking Crew. #555 Mickey Thompson’s old number. Remember go fast and take chances! Guy Mobbley

  83. 83 Joe joe Jun 12th, 2010 at 1:59 pm

    When will they learn too liquid cool the motors? H-D and INDIAN which use the same designed motor still using old technology. Top ends being rebuilt with only 30 to 40K on them when you are not a phony fair weather rider. and for H-D, many of the OEM parts inside the bike, even the rims on some have a stamp in the material (JAPAN) go figure. The funny thing is they sell these bikes for 3X the amount of the metrics.

  1. 1 Indian Motorcycles Riding In Sturgis For Tribal Hope Foundation at Cyril Huze Blog Pingback on Aug 3rd, 2009 at 7:37 pm
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